An observation about guitar cables

Lake Placid Blues

Lake Placid Blues

New member
Today I was messing around with a little Orange MT20. I was running it through a Marshall 4x12 with GBs. It was sounding really good. I left for awhile and came back plugging in again and that nice tone was gone gone gone. There was a harshness in the upper mids that was actually quite annoying. I figure well maybe this amp is inconsistent being 1/2 solid state or something. As I'm rolling up, I realized that the first time I had been using a George L instrument cable and the second time a different one. So I plug in with the George L and the good tone is back. I then try both cables into the JTM45. They both sound good but the George L sounded a wee bit better. A bit smoother, and richer. It's not like the other cable is a junk cable at all, and its not really long either. Interesting.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

Is there really a difference in cables tonewise ? I just use Yorkville and planet waves cables with fender patch cables on my pedalboard... I figured I'd rather save my money from not buying super expensive cables, I mean how much can it affect your sound in band settings.. I think it's all hype but then again the most expensive cable I have used is a planet waves.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

different cables have different capacitance meaning that higher frequencies will be rolled off in different amounts. Playing through any cable is like literally wiring a small tone capacitor in series with your guitar and whatever your cable connects to (your pedals or amps). It adds up more and more depending on how long the cable is.
Many manufacturers of good to high-end cables list the capacitance per foot and lower numbers means less tone loss.
Personally I can hear the difference between cheap cables and good ones if they're longer than about 10 feet. It's gonna depend on the player wether or not the crowd hears it. Some people who don't need any more treble anyways can compensate via the amp, but some who like playing with a brighter, clearer, or sizzling tone may find that long cheap-sounding cables rob too much punch and definition.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

Welcome to the world of Eric Johnson. :D
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

My additional observation:
The other thing to consider is what room you will be playing in. You could spend 10x the money getting better cable to not lose that vital 3% bit of 10khz - 16khz high end, and then find yourself playing in rooms full of people, upholstery, carpeting and curtains that suck out far more treble than what the cheaper cable was, and then end up trying to compensate some other way like diming treble and presence and/or sticking EQ pedals/racks in the path.

If you are recording, where a mic is going right in front of the amp and that's going to 'tape' or some form people will listen to directly, I think the money cable is a better, almost necessary investment. But if the money cable is worth it to you for personal satisfaction of what you are hearing standing in front of the amp, then by all means go for it, you should enjoy what you are doing. Anything that enhances the experience for the player is worth it because you can improve as a player when you are not fighting your equipment, and the result likely will be something others can enjoy too.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

Lake Placid Blues said:
Today I was messing around with a little Orange MT20. I was running it through a Marshall 4x12 with GBs. It was sounding really good. I left for awhile and came back plugging in again and that nice tone was gone gone gone. There was a harshness in the upper mids that was actually quite annoying. I figure well maybe this amp is inconsistent being 1/2 solid state or something. As I'm rolling up, I realized that the first time I had been using a George L instrument cable and the second time a different one. So I plug in with the George L and the good tone is back. I then try both cables into the JTM45. They both sound good but the George L sounded a wee bit better. A bit smoother, and richer. It's not like the other cable is a junk cable at all, and its not really long either. Interesting.
Click to expand...

Actually the most likely reason is that the other one is not long enough.

I bet that the George L has just the right capacitance and the other one not enough. Then the resonance peak of your pickup isn't in the same position.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

I've basically asked about this very question yet haven't really spent to much time digging in.
I can speak from the replay angle and tell you there are differences in sound quality per quality of wire used.
I'm a Audio Video Custom Integration Installer/ Programmer and over my 15 years in the business I have noticed differences in wiring weather it be Cat 5 or 6 , speaker wire , analog Interconnects , Digital cables in Optical coax and HDMI etc.
It really comes down to materials used , proper relationship between conductors and terminations. Now once the proper goal is achieved , nothing more can be done to improve signal transfer. What happens with lower quality cables of any kind is they are not properly terminated , they may not pass spec , they may act like an antenna and pick up more signals while trying to pass along whatever you are passing.
Another thing to consider is length , if the cable is within it's ability to pass the entire signal , it will perform correctly , if you take it to or past it's abilities then alter the end result you will.

I use 15 foot or less Guitar cables and honestly haven't noticed much of a difference in them so far. Honestly I have not conducted a heavy A vs B shootout and listened to my tone. I play in my basement on a rubber gym floor and route my cables for the least amount of interference. So I'm not sure how much better higher then what I own quality is going to make( I use mostly Whirlwind but have some other brands as well). I don't buy cheap cables but don't buy the highest end either.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

One difference between guitar cables and the AV stuff you run into in your day job is the output impedance of the source device. That difference makes the guitar much more sensitive to cable capacitance compared to the low-impedance sources in AV gear. Using EMGs or other buffers can largely eliminate that factor but unless the buffer is onboard, you're still affected by the capacitance of the cable between your guitar and the the buffer.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

FuseG4 said:
Playing through any cable is like literally wiring a small tone capacitor in series with your guitar and whatever your cable connects to (your pedals or amps).
Click to expand...

Parallel.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

Lake Placid Blues said:
Today I was messing around with a little Orange MT20. I was running it through a Marshall 4x12 with GBs. It was sounding really good. I left for awhile and came back plugging in again and that nice tone was gone gone gone. There was a harshness in the upper mids that was actually quite annoying. I figure well maybe this amp is inconsistent being 1/2 solid state or something. As I'm rolling up, I realized that the first time I had been using a George L instrument cable and the second time a different one. So I plug in with the George L and the good tone is back. I then try both cables into the JTM45. They both sound good but the George L sounded a wee bit better. A bit smoother, and richer. It's not like the other cable is a junk cable at all, and its not really long either. Interesting.
Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing that; it takes a good ear to hear the difference between cables. I can definitely tell a difference between some of the cables I have used!
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

mantis said:
I've basically asked about this very question yet haven't really spent to much time digging in.
I can speak from the replay angle and tell you there are differences in sound quality per quality of wire used.
I'm a Audio Video Custom Integration Installer/ Programmer and over my 15 years in the business I have noticed differences in wiring weather it be Cat 5 or 6 , speaker wire , analog Interconnects , Digital cables in Optical coax and HDMI etc.
It really comes down to materials used , proper relationship between conductors and terminations. Now once the proper goal is achieved , nothing more can be done to improve signal transfer. What happens with lower quality cables of any kind is they are not properly terminated , they may not pass spec , they may act like an antenna and pick up more signals while trying to pass along whatever you are passing.
Another thing to consider is length , if the cable is within it's ability to pass the entire signal , it will perform correctly , if you take it to or past it's abilities then alter the end result you will.

I use 15 foot or less Guitar cables and honestly haven't noticed much of a difference in them so far. Honestly I have not conducted a heavy A vs B shootout and listened to my tone. I play in my basement on a rubber gym floor and route my cables for the least amount of interference. So I'm not sure how much better higher then what I own quality is going to make( I use mostly Whirlwind but have some other brands as well). I don't buy cheap cables but don't buy the highest end either.
Click to expand...

I agree with your statements on audio interconnects, but what is it on digital cabling where you noticed a difference? Is it just that cables that do not perform correctly lead to signal loss and digital artifacts, or have you noticed other differences?
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

Grindspine said:
I agree with your statements on audio interconnects, but what is it on digital cabling where you noticed a difference? Is it just that cables that do not perform correctly lead to signal loss and digital artifacts, or have you noticed other differences?
Click to expand...
Digital coax cables I have not heard any differences at all and I've conducted shootouts with cables ranging from $29-$300 for a 1m cable. Optical same thing except we did find some differences with he one that was offered in the box of a Mitsubishi sat box , it's the cheapest built optical cable and I think it's restrictive as it sounded a bit thin and seem to be missing information. Other then that cable about the same range of Coax priced cables where tested and no differences where found.
HDMI is the new beast in the digital area and not many differences where noticed. Going from a cheap $10 cable to a $200 cable very little differences where noticed at a 1m length.
However Audio and video improvements where noticed on high end equipment with the higher end cables. The cheaper cable I believe isn't terminated correctly , uses cheap materials and probably doesn't offer good shielding is the only reasons I can think of why it wouldn't perform exactly as a higher end cable would with better built quality and materials.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

mantis said:
Digital coax cables I have not heard any differences at all and I've conducted shootouts with cables ranging from $29-$300 for a 1m cable. Optical same thing except we did find some differences with he one that was offered in the box of a Mitsubishi sat box , it's the cheapest built optical cable and I think it's restrictive as it sounded a bit thin and seem to be missing information. Other then that cable about the same range of Coax priced cables where tested and no differences where found.
HDMI is the new beast in the digital area and not many differences where noticed. Going from a cheap $10 cable to a $200 cable very little differences where noticed at a 1m length.
However Audio and video improvements where noticed on high end equipment with the higher end cables. The cheaper cable I believe isn't terminated correctly , uses cheap materials and probably doesn't offer good shielding is the only reasons I can think of why it wouldn't perform exactly as a higher end cable would with better built quality and materials.
Click to expand...

Just make sure you plug in the Ethernet cable following the arrows on it so that the packets flow the right way :)

http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AKDL1-Dedicated-Link-Cable/product-reviews/B000I1X6PM
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

I definitely hear a difference but more in the difference between a dirt cheap cable vs. a quality branded cable. Not so much when one is on the same level and quality as another. The differences are there but are much smaller and not so easy to hear.
 
Re: An observation about guitar cables

Anyway.

I really haven't seen anything in this thread that couldn't be explained with different capacitance (except for outright broken cables).
 
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