Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
- Thread starter shredi
- Start date
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
What makes this odd is that we were telling you exactly the same thing through many posts, and you said we were incorrect.......how now do we come to the fact that you changed your approach 180 degrees??? Baffling.
You could have stopped this and the last one a long time ago.
What makes this odd is that we were telling you exactly the same thing through many posts, and you said we were incorrect.......how now do we come to the fact that you changed your approach 180 degrees??? Baffling.
You could have stopped this and the last one a long time ago.
Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
a list below is for 6 humbuckers with similar construction and magnet types:
Dimarzio Steve's special dcr 18.21k average output 390mv
Dimarzio evolution dcr 13.84k average output 404mv
Dimarzio illumination dcr 10.56k average output 410mv
Dimarzio dominion dcr 16k average output 360mv
Dimarzio dactivator dcr 11.41k average output 470mv
Dimarzio super 3 dcr 25k average output 435mv
Please display the linear correlation between dcr and measured average output based on the data above.
a list below is for 6 humbuckers with similar construction and magnet types:
Dimarzio Steve's special dcr 18.21k average output 390mv
Dimarzio evolution dcr 13.84k average output 404mv
Dimarzio illumination dcr 10.56k average output 410mv
Dimarzio dominion dcr 16k average output 360mv
Dimarzio dactivator dcr 11.41k average output 470mv
Dimarzio super 3 dcr 25k average output 435mv
Please display the linear correlation between dcr and measured average output based on the data above.
Clint 55
OH THE DOUBLE THICK GLAZE!
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
:smack:Statistics isn't picking all the data with the outcome you want and then ignoring the rest. It's taking a large sample and then determining the stats. I made as an example all Duncans. Or you could use all Duncans and Dimarzios. If you look at all Duncans, there's a loose linear relationship between dcr and output. Some organize roungly in order while others can be off. You don't look at one piece of data or a few you like and say, that's the rule!
:smack:Statistics isn't picking all the data with the outcome you want and then ignoring the rest. It's taking a large sample and then determining the stats. I made as an example all Duncans. Or you could use all Duncans and Dimarzios. If you look at all Duncans, there's a loose linear relationship between dcr and output. Some organize roungly in order while others can be off. You don't look at one piece of data or a few you like and say, that's the rule!
Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
But that is exactly what you did with your dcr=output nonsense. If you are speaking in absolutes like that you need to back it up. Now please I want you to prove the correlation of dcr to output with the data I supplied you. BTW I didn't pick models with the data I wanted, I picked models based on similar construction i.e. Predominantly ceramic high output humbuckers with two sets of Allen poles and brass base plate. Now please answer, im waiting, chop chop.
But that is exactly what you did with your dcr=output nonsense. If you are speaking in absolutes like that you need to back it up. Now please I want you to prove the correlation of dcr to output with the data I supplied you. BTW I didn't pick models with the data I wanted, I picked models based on similar construction i.e. Predominantly ceramic high output humbuckers with two sets of Allen poles and brass base plate. Now please answer, im waiting, chop chop.
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Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
Not even close 100%. Now please do so, I await your dcr correlation theory on the data I supplied.
Not even close 100%. Now please do so, I await your dcr correlation theory on the data I supplied.
Clint 55
OH THE DOUBLE THICK GLAZE!
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
Then reread the last 3 pages, particularly my resolution with Alex, and quit trolling me.
I don't have the software right now to plot all the data, and determine the correlation coefficient or standard deviations right now. Although I could if I had the emotional involvement in this issue that you seem to have.
Then reread the last 3 pages, particularly my resolution with Alex, and quit trolling me.
I don't have the software right now to plot all the data, and determine the correlation coefficient or standard deviations right now. Although I could if I had the emotional involvement in this issue that you seem to have.
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Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
So in other words you have nothing...
So in other words you have nothing...
Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
I gave you six good models for your dcr correlation theory, here they are again in case you forgot:
Evolution
Steve's special
Dominion
Illuminator
Dactivator
Super3
Hell, add the imperium 13.7k output 325mv, dactivator neck 7.22k. Output 380mv, titan 11.07k 411mv those are all of similar construct as well
Now get to it, I'm still waiting, :sleeping:
I gave you six good models for your dcr correlation theory, here they are again in case you forgot:
Evolution
Steve's special
Dominion
Illuminator
Dactivator
Super3
Hell, add the imperium 13.7k output 325mv, dactivator neck 7.22k. Output 380mv, titan 11.07k 411mv those are all of similar construct as well
Now get to it, I'm still waiting, :sleeping:
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Clint 55
OH THE DOUBLE THICK GLAZE!
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
I'm not going to deal with you if you're going to act like a child. For the 18th time, hand picking pickups whose output don't directly relate to their Dcr doesn't mean Dcr means nothing or that there's no relationship between Dcr and output. "Dcr means nothing" means that if you arrange all Duncan pickups in order of thier Dcr, the outputs will be random. But that isn't the case. The 8k ones are generally in the vintage output category, and the 16k ones are generally in the hot output category. Therefore, there's still a relationship between Dcr and output, even if some are way off. Find someone else to harass with your troll account.
I'm not going to deal with you if you're going to act like a child. For the 18th time, hand picking pickups whose output don't directly relate to their Dcr doesn't mean Dcr means nothing or that there's no relationship between Dcr and output. "Dcr means nothing" means that if you arrange all Duncan pickups in order of thier Dcr, the outputs will be random. But that isn't the case. The 8k ones are generally in the vintage output category, and the 16k ones are generally in the hot output category. Therefore, there's still a relationship between Dcr and output, even if some are way off. Find someone else to harass with your troll account.
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Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
I'm the one asking you for a reasonable task, your the one acting out because you put your foot in your mouth... maybe both feet at this point.
BTW as I've tried to explain to you numerous times, the models are not chosen to promote a confirmation bias, they are chosen because they are relatively of similar construction to each other, meaning similar magnets, dimensions, base plates and relatively speaking pole piece type. That's actually pretty much all of them in dimarzio's catalogue that are similar in those regards. It gives you a relatively nice even playing field to apply your dcr correlation theory.
I'm the one asking you for a reasonable task, your the one acting out because you put your foot in your mouth... maybe both feet at this point.
BTW as I've tried to explain to you numerous times, the models are not chosen to promote a confirmation bias, they are chosen because they are relatively of similar construction to each other, meaning similar magnets, dimensions, base plates and relatively speaking pole piece type. That's actually pretty much all of them in dimarzio's catalogue that are similar in those regards. It gives you a relatively nice even playing field to apply your dcr correlation theory.
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Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
So in other words, you don't know, and you are now willing to concede you spoke in absolutes about something without giving it clear critical thought. It's okay, your forgiven, we all make mistakes from time to time and learn something along the way.
So in other words, you don't know, and you are now willing to concede you spoke in absolutes about something without giving it clear critical thought. It's okay, your forgiven, we all make mistakes from time to time and learn something along the way.
frankfalbo
In Fluence Y'all
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
Hey Joey, can you please just identify yourself? Joey Voltage doesn't sound like a birth name (forgive me if it is) You joined yesterday, to resurrect a 3-month old thread with a dissertation about active pickup technology, and already you've come out swinging here, almost as though you have an agenda. I'm not a moderator here, and normally I wouldn't ask. But I assume I speak for others when I say your immediate activity here, coupled with your obvious grasp of rudimentary pickup mechanics makes this situation unique. Are you a pickup maker and seller? Do you own a pickup company? Or plan to? Is there a vendetta carried over from activity on another forum or facebook? Normally someone "brand new" doesn't just show up and start arguments, regardless of whether their content has merit.
Hey Joey, can you please just identify yourself? Joey Voltage doesn't sound like a birth name (forgive me if it is) You joined yesterday, to resurrect a 3-month old thread with a dissertation about active pickup technology, and already you've come out swinging here, almost as though you have an agenda. I'm not a moderator here, and normally I wouldn't ask. But I assume I speak for others when I say your immediate activity here, coupled with your obvious grasp of rudimentary pickup mechanics makes this situation unique. Are you a pickup maker and seller? Do you own a pickup company? Or plan to? Is there a vendetta carried over from activity on another forum or facebook? Normally someone "brand new" doesn't just show up and start arguments, regardless of whether their content has merit.
Joey Voltage
New member
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
Frank, I don't believe I was the one who started the argument, if you go back you will see multiple attempts by myself and others to dispel a very common misconception (one at this point shouldn't even need to be acknowledged), and talk some sense into the user, very respectively and with out making headway. It also seems this user from what I have gathered has had run ins like this before. When reasoning failed many, many times, I simply opted to make the user prove his assumption in a well thought out, studious manner, even though I know most who have strong convictions will frustratingly stick by their assumptions no mater how much education you throw at them. however, these days, I have very little tolerance for it simply because it's exhausting and ime taking the high road seldom really works. And no, I don't have commercial affiliations as far as the pick up industry is concerned, not at this point in time at least, the market is fairly oversaturated as is, and would prefer to keep it on a non commercial level, I find it more enjoyable that way. I do have other commercial interests in other related markets but nothing that really would bleed over into this place.
I don't think I would have called that quite a dissertation per se of active design lol, and as far as rudimentary knowledge of pickup mechanics, to quote you my friend, you would be surprised at what I do and do not know.
Frank, I don't believe I was the one who started the argument, if you go back you will see multiple attempts by myself and others to dispel a very common misconception (one at this point shouldn't even need to be acknowledged), and talk some sense into the user, very respectively and with out making headway. It also seems this user from what I have gathered has had run ins like this before. When reasoning failed many, many times, I simply opted to make the user prove his assumption in a well thought out, studious manner, even though I know most who have strong convictions will frustratingly stick by their assumptions no mater how much education you throw at them. however, these days, I have very little tolerance for it simply because it's exhausting and ime taking the high road seldom really works. And no, I don't have commercial affiliations as far as the pick up industry is concerned, not at this point in time at least, the market is fairly oversaturated as is, and would prefer to keep it on a non commercial level, I find it more enjoyable that way. I do have other commercial interests in other related markets but nothing that really would bleed over into this place.
I don't think I would have called that quite a dissertation per se of active design lol, and as far as rudimentary knowledge of pickup mechanics, to quote you my friend, you would be surprised at what I do and do not know.
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frankfalbo
In Fluence Y'all
Re: Custom vs Custom 8 thoughts?
So, are you going to tell us who you are? This forum has had its share of knowledgeable yet confrontational keyboard warriors in the past and it always brings everybody down here. You also seem to suggest you're quoting me at the end of your post, I have no idea from where you're quoting me or in what context, but it implies some level of engagement. If you're a previously banned member then please for the love of all things magnetic, tell us now and save us the drama.
If you're truly a brand new member, who just happened upon this forum (which is difficult to rectify with your self described low tolerance level for these types of exchanges) then welcome.
As for DCR and output, the (obvious) general consensus is that all other things equal, DCR relates to output under the implication that it correlates directly to more turns of wire. For example the 59 neck and bridge, Jazz & Alnico 2 Pro neck and bridge...the bridge pickups are louder. And not for nothing, sometimes Dimarzio's mV test method gets called into question. If I remember correctly it's an individual A string being plucked, which makes it plausible that pickups with resonance at or near harmonic multiples of A could show a slight increase in output under that test vs a model whose resonance is atonally related to A.
As a PSA, one thing that is probably a myth in practice is the notion that if you have 2 pickups that are supposed to be the same, like 2 JB's, and one reads higher than the other, many assume that one is louder. They pick the higher number as though it means more turns of wire were "accidentally" added, or under the false notion that DCR in isolation does correlate to output. The reality is, if the quality control is such that we know the turn counts are equal between the two, it could mean the wire on the higher DCR is on the thin side of tolerance, or has been stretched under tension. In that case the lower DCR could be the louder one. But this is counterintuitive to the vintage Gibson understanding, that higher DCR's correlated to the winder taking more time to disengage the clutch.
Thats kind of my point. Joey says he has very little tolerance for whatever it is that caused the escalation in rhetoric. As with most things in life, "who started it" is irrelevant. We all are responsible for our behavior at every step of escalation.
So, are you going to tell us who you are? This forum has had its share of knowledgeable yet confrontational keyboard warriors in the past and it always brings everybody down here. You also seem to suggest you're quoting me at the end of your post, I have no idea from where you're quoting me or in what context, but it implies some level of engagement. If you're a previously banned member then please for the love of all things magnetic, tell us now and save us the drama.
If you're truly a brand new member, who just happened upon this forum (which is difficult to rectify with your self described low tolerance level for these types of exchanges) then welcome.
As for DCR and output, the (obvious) general consensus is that all other things equal, DCR relates to output under the implication that it correlates directly to more turns of wire. For example the 59 neck and bridge, Jazz & Alnico 2 Pro neck and bridge...the bridge pickups are louder. And not for nothing, sometimes Dimarzio's mV test method gets called into question. If I remember correctly it's an individual A string being plucked, which makes it plausible that pickups with resonance at or near harmonic multiples of A could show a slight increase in output under that test vs a model whose resonance is atonally related to A.
As a PSA, one thing that is probably a myth in practice is the notion that if you have 2 pickups that are supposed to be the same, like 2 JB's, and one reads higher than the other, many assume that one is louder. They pick the higher number as though it means more turns of wire were "accidentally" added, or under the false notion that DCR in isolation does correlate to output. The reality is, if the quality control is such that we know the turn counts are equal between the two, it could mean the wire on the higher DCR is on the thin side of tolerance, or has been stretched under tension. In that case the lower DCR could be the louder one. But this is counterintuitive to the vintage Gibson understanding, that higher DCR's correlated to the winder taking more time to disengage the clutch.
