Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

[Starman]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

I contacted the custom shop about winding me a custom first set of JBs (hotter bridge and full strength mags) and was told no. They want to keep these as limited. I didn't speak to MJ, so it's still a possibility. This is just what I encountered earlier in the year.


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Sorry I feel I have hijacked someone's thread!! Hopefully the OP won't mind as my issue does somewhat have to do with the same matter?

Now after hearing many responses to my post I'm a bit confused too. I don't want to "devalue" this set per se but seeing as these are still available for sale I can't see selling this set for the same price as new thus I would take a loss anyway? And I also would hate to sell this set to someone on eBay etc. knowing the bridge tone is so damn awful. Maybe that's just my opinion? I compare most of my LP vintage tones to either the custombuckers in my R8 or to the PGCS BFG set in my R9. They are to me the epitome of what I want a vintage Les Paul to sound like.

I guess I will also be limited by what MJ is willing to do. I'm also not sure if I can convey properly the terms to describe what I want. I just expected it to be thicker and louder with some rock and roll attitude, which it isn't.

 

[zionstrat]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

Sorry I feel I have hijacked someone's thread!! Hopefully the OP won't mind as my issue does somewhat have to do with the same matter?

Now after hearing many responses to my post I'm a bit confused too. I don't want to "devalue" this set per se but seeing as these are still available for sale I can't see selling this set for the same price as new thus I would take a loss anyway? And I also would hate to sell this set to someone on eBay etc. knowing the bridge tone is so damn awful. Maybe that's just my opinion? I compare most of my LP vintage tones to either the custombuckers in my R8 or to the PGCS BFG set in my R9. They are to me the epitome of what I want a vintage Les Paul to sound like.

I guess I will also be limited by what MJ is willing to do. I'm also not sure if I can convey properly the terms to describe what I want. I just expected it to be thicker and louder with some rock and roll attitude, which it isn't.

Shows what I know.. I thought Skinners were a completed limited run.

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[AlexR]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

Well, the customshop page dedicated to the skinnerburst pickup set says sold out

 

[jeremy]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

yes, i thought that run was finished. doesnt mean dealers dont have sets on the shelves but i believe the custom shop made all they are planning on making.

starman, the fact that you say the sh5 matches well with the skinner neck suggests to me that you want more than what the skinner bridge is supposed to give you. the cspg is a pretty fat sounding take on a paf, i have no real experience with the custom buckers but i a3 is usually fairly thin in the bridge, which as i mentioned before, can work great into a roaring big tweed amp or plexi

 

[Starman]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

yes, i thought that run was finished. doesnt mean dealers dont have sets on the shelves but i believe the custom shop made all they are planning on making.

starman, the fact that you say the sh5 matches well with the skinner neck suggests to me that you want more than what the skinner bridge is supposed to give you. the cspg is a pretty fat sounding take on a paf, i have no real experience with the custom buckers but i a3 is usually fairly thin in the bridge, which as i mentioned before, can work great into a roaring big tweed amp or plexi

There are Skinnerburst sets for sale at dealers, seems to be a lot of sets on the web being offered currently.

Jeremy, this may be the case without a doubt....the Skinners I understand are a "bright" PAF by all accounts.....but then I ask myself what the huge volume / tone / thickness difference between the neck and bridge in two separate guitars ???

The Skinnerburst neck I have is anything but thin, weak, sterile....it is just a tiny bit dryer than an APH-2 I have in a Goldtop but sounds along the same lines as the Slash neck. Is not a sizzler like a PGCS... but not many are.

The Skinner bridge at anything below Vol knob 7 is nearly non existent. That says excessively weak to me?

 

[jeremy]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

maybe? could be the magnet got degaussed or who knows. mj is a wizard so she will sort it out if there anything wrong and set it straight

 

[eclecticsynergy]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

A3 is the weakest of the alnicos to begin with. In a low wind pickup it's just not gonna have strong output, especially at the bridge. There's good reason why modern sets have the bridge pickup wound hotter.

That A3 bridge might make a great neck pickup in another instrument. These are limited run pickups. If I were you I might keep it instead of modding it, and find something a little beefier for the guitar in question.

 

[YeRedHouseOverYonder]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

^^^ +1

IME, A3 in a humbucker bridge is just too timid and polite. My ears prefer the output of other mags. Even hotter winds with A3 is still not all there.


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[Starman]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

I'm past the novelty or collectibility of this set. Sure it would have been nice to have them be perfect for my tastes but it didn't happen. Selling them id just take a loss and the neck sounds great, the aging is done nicely, etc...

I'm going to let MJ advise me on what can be done to wake this thing up.

 

[AlexR]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

A3 is certainly a mag that requires a good wind.

I've had enough pickups with A3 in where they are superb tonally to know they do work.......even in vintage strat type winds. In fact all of my A3 pickups are stellar....but I'm not expecting fat and thick from any of my pickups - thats not really what a PAF is about.

 

[majewsky]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

A3's in Seth Lovers are the best for me, but just as with Skinner Bursts here, the bridge is underpowered HOWEVER it's got that beautiful tele-ish/single coil-ish sound that works great clean, and when combined with EP Booster and Green Rhino it can easily go into black sabbath territory. The neck pickup is for me the ideal jazz pickup and for cleans is just perfect. I'll probably send them for rewind to wind them sligtly hotter, becauce ~7,smth k neck, and ~8,2k bridge for A3 is just not enough. I imagine it would shine with ~8,5k neck and ~10k bridge (like brobucker).

 

[jeremy]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

8.2k to 10k is a big jump if you keep with #42 wire. i had a 9.4k antiquity wound in the custom shop years ago and with a full strength polished a2 that thing was damn near perfect for a really hot paf tone

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

Just to chime in on the PAF thing, yes, they can be bright.

The neck pickup in my LP/SG is very clear, but still has that neck position fatness. The bridge, however, almost bites like a Telecaster. It's tricky to dial an amp tone for both to sound good, and impossible without messing with the guitar's volume & tone controls.

 

[jeremy]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

youd be surprised how different things sound 20' in front of the amp in a band context. the pearly gates set is notorious for having a big tonal mismatch between the neck and bridge. years ago i had a gibson lp special with the pg set in it and someone took a high quality video of a gig. it was guitar->cable->amp. the big difference i heard on stage was significantly smaller on the recording. you could tell i switched pups but the difference was much smaller than i expected. im sure some of that had to do with the amp and but it surprised me how much difference there was between stage and audience.

 

[zionstrat]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

Agreed 100%. Have been blessed with engineers who have walked my zoom around the room to give m e a feel of average sound around room. Of course the zoom colors sound as well, but on average I can tell the difference from room to room and stage is rarely similar to room unless engineer has put a good monitor mix together.

Also have added cell phone recordings and they seem to do just as good a job on average.

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[Starman]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

So I heard from SD today (Arwin) and they have the Skinnerburst bridge I sent in for eval. As I suspected it checked out fine and was even played in a LP to verify. He did agree it's a bright bridge in design, and as many have stated in this thread it just isn't my particular type of tone/PAF-variant. After much debate I asked if they could make it hotter and they are going to install an A5 magnet in it for me and ship it back along with the original A3. I hope it gets to where I want it at that point? I asked him about a rough cast A5 and he said the CS would discuss what exact A5 would be best.

 

[AlexR]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

^ Have you played that set in multiple guitars??

I've found the guitar is as important as the pickup when it comes to PAF clones.

 

[Starman]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

^ Have you played that set in multiple guitars??

I've found the guitar is as important as the pickup when it comes to PAF clones.

Yep put it in 3 separate LP's, all with 50's wiring. Same result.

 

[zionstrat]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

Yep put it in 3 separate LP's, all with 50's wiring. Same result.

Starman, thanks for input very helpful-

Revisiting my client's skinners from the start of the thread, a few players came through the shop and liked the new tone and the client is happy, so all's well that ends well.

However, I really would like to have tried them in a darker guitar to see if that would have made any difference- So you helped me out by trying three guitars, I've got these logged in as bright pups and I hope your a5 does the trick!

 

[Mincer]

Re: Disappointed with Skinner Bursts- Maybe the amp? Guru thoughts?

So I heard from SD today (Arwin) and they have the Skinnerburst bridge I sent in for eval. As I suspected it checked out fine and was even played in a LP to verify. He did agree it's a bright bridge in design, and as many have stated in this thread it just isn't my particular type of tone/PAF-variant. After much debate I asked if they could make it hotter and they are going to install an A5 magnet in it for me and ship it back along with the original A3. I hope it gets to where I want it at that point? I asked him about a rough cast A5 and he said the CS would discuss what exact A5 would be best.

I appreciate the update. I think in the end, everyone wants you to be happy. I don't know how bright the Skinnerburst are compared to, say, the Antiquity, much less in an LP, so this is all new to me.