Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

LtKojak

New member
Hi good folk at the SDUGF, I've taken some pictures of my original Dirty Fingers and I thought to publish'em here, just for the sake of sharing information and knowledge.

As you can see, Dirty Fingers have TWO rows of screws and three double-thick ceramic magnets. All other p'ups with different specs, although produced in the same era, are NOT DFs.





This is an ORIGINAL DF, taken out from a 1978 Explorer. This particular one has the Schaller bobbins, which makes it extremely rare.
It measures 16.32K @23°C, with the South Coil measuring 8.20K, and the North Coil 8.12K.

As the coil offset is very small to negligible, I think it's safe to say that the design calls for balanced coils, attributing the difference to a small inconsistency in diameter of the wire itself, although completely within standard requirements, which seems to be SPN AWG #44, so I think the nominal DC of this design should be 16K, consistent in 2x 8K bobbins.

The visual inspection of the coils indicate that the tension used in the winding of these coils is on the loose side, as you can see the wire moving when touching it with a finger.



No potting, the finished bobbins didn't even have a shielding or protective tape. Note the red dot, marking the North side of the spacer magnet.



You can see the three double-thick magnets used, plus how the South start is soldered to the baseplate.



This is how the coil joint was made. Kinda hacky, isn't it? Norlin in a nutshell. :naughty:

The interesting thing to see is the inverted-pyramid shape of the coil, a coil geometry shape consistent with several good-sounding PAFs I've seen. Seems that somebody was "doing something right" despite the Suit's policies at the time, which knew absolutely NOTHING 'bout guitars, music, tone and couldn't care less 'bout. For the record, NOBODY PLAYED GUITAR, NOT EVEN EVER HAD A GUITAR IN THEIR HANDS at Norlin's board at that time.

That was the people LEADING the company. Then tell me how GREAT Norlin instruments are! :naughty:

If something was made right at that time, was because of the nameless and faceless little guy, disobeying direct orders and risking his job because he still had pride in what he knew and what he did and just couldn't let go of being stomped all over by the arrogant and ignorant new masters.

Wow, it sounds just like the story of my life in Italy! :(

Enjoy! :cool2: :wave:
 
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Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

Thx, Pepe. Interesting, as always.

I haven't played a DF for approximatively 31 years... And it was through a crappy SS amp. How does it sound through a good one?
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

Thx, Pepe. Interesting, as always.

I haven't played a DF for approximatively 31 years... And it was through a crappy SS amp. How does it sound through a good one?

Well... Let's say that's NOT my cup of tea, shall we?

However, my gut feeling tells me that this particular one might sound good with an UOA5, an A2 or even an A3, which I'd normally not use in a bridge p'up.


HTH,
 
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Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

I never cared for the old DF back in the day. I ripped them out immediately, but they are a great heavy rock/metal pup. Very articulate, even under ton sof gain.

IMO the new DF PLUS with A2 is a much more usable pickup. Still articulate and clear, but the highs and mids are softened up enough. Also cleans up on the volume knob very well. I would say its what most people wished the Custom Custom was.
 
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Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

Hi Pepe, could you explain that inverted pyramid coil thing you spoke about? Is that the windings being thicker in top and then tapering down toward the bottom of the coil in a V shape? Basically more density of wire at the top of the coil?

Thanks
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

Hi Pepe, could you explain that inverted pyramid coil thing you spoke about? Is that the windings being thicker in top and then tapering down toward the bottom of the coil in a V shape? Basically more density of wire at the top of the coil?

Thanks

Yes, exactly as you've said it.
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

It is only available in the new ES studio models, Pepe. So far not aftermarket. If you go over the Gibson homepage, check out the 335 studio and check out the details tab or whatever, it says DF plus (a2). I cannot c&p links with this NOOK reader, otherwise I would.

I own one, FWIW.
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

check out the 335 studio and check out the details tab or whatever, it says DF plus (a2).

http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/ES/Gibson-Memphis/ES-335-Studio/Specs.aspx

Yes, it so says here, however...

http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/ES/Gibson-Memphis/ES-339-Studio/Specs.aspx

By mistake I clicked this one by mistake and guess what? It says DF 2 but ceramic. WTF? I mean, if it existed a DF2 ceramic, what would it the difference be with the DF? Maybe that the DF2 ceramic doesn't use three, double-thick ceramics?

Can you trust Gibson with ANYTHING, REALLY?

I shake my head in disbelief at Gibson... again! :smack:

:sigh:
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

There were a bunch of incorrect specs when the 335S was first introduced compared to when production started to roll out. Binding and board material for instance.

Most defintely the plus is not ceramic...one or otherwise.
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

Verycool. Love me some Dirty Fingers!!!!!

Had a chance to buy a KILLER 78 Explorer with them. regrets....

But I have two Norlins that I love.
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

I would like to see what differences exist between the new Dirty Fingers and the old one.
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

I would like to see what differences exist between the new Dirty Fingers and the old one.

The new ones are potted, and the alloys used in the making of keepers and screws are different. The old triple double-thick mag most probably is Ceramic 5.

Nowadays, this Ceramic grade is not offered anymore, so everybody uses Ceramic 8 mags, which is brighter and more powerful than Ceramic 5.

So, if you add a brighter alloy in the screws and keepers with a brighter, more powerful magnet, the tonal outcome most probably is "nails on a chalkboard" on cleans, "nest of angry wasps" on OD.

Until now, I haven't seen any comment about how good the newer DFs are, however, the DF Plus, a DF with an A2 magnet, found only in the new ES-335 Studio, owned by our own JeffB, is not bad at all. Just ask HIM 'bout it! ;)

For the record, in Italy, the ES-335 Studio is NOT yet offered.

HTH,
 
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Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

I'm liking this series of opening up pickups and examining them. Keep it up.

Well, thank you!

I thought that with Frank Falbo gone, only very few members would REALLY appreciate the effort. ;)

BTW, my take on the Epi Probuckers was a promess made to him a long time ago. And being a man of my word, so I delivered.

HTH,
 
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Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

For the record, I have not tried a new DF (standard) , only the Plus. FWIW, it did not have significantly more high end than the 57 classic that replaced it. It had gobs of midrange, and very punchy midrange at that, and gobs of output, but it was not muddy in the mids, like a JB or CC can be. Good string separation in my rig. I wish I had made a clip before I pulled it out.

I am not a big fan of HO pups in my old age,and I expected the worst with the DFP, I was surprised how good it sounds, but it still not my thing.
 
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Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

Well, thank you!

I thought that with Frank Falbo gone, only very few members would REALLY appreciate the effort. ;)

BTW, my take on the Epi Probuckers was a promess made to him a long time ago. And being a man of my word, so I delivered.

HTH,

It is possible by any chance you could write up a very general guide to what particular aspects in a wind may cause a characteristic in the sound of a pickup? For example: "What specific effect does wind tension have in the sound of a pickup?" Or: "What could cause a emphasis on certain frequencies?".
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

I'm liking this series of opening up pickups and examining them. Keep it up.

+1. Thanks Pepe. Always insightful.

Like you, I'm surprised that there's no protective tape on the coils. And it looks like it's single lead; like 4-leads are prohibitively expensive for them to do to all their PU's.
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

I don't think a Dirty Fingers would be worth a flip with out an A8 in the bridge and an A4 in the neck. then they would be the Dirty Whisperer set.
 
Re: Gibson Dirty Fingers: a closer look

I don't think a Dirty Fingers would be worth a flip with out an A8 in the bridge and an A4 in the neck. then they would be the Dirty Whisperer set.

Naahhh... it would be just "Dirty". LOL!

Anyway, what appeals to me the most of the DF design, is the double row of screws. It gives you the potential of tweak the string balance and coil offset to the max, actually upgrading the original PAF by Seth Lover, which called for double row of slugs. This is particularly important in the neck p'up, where the strings move laterally the most.

If I ever order a Custom Shop p'up, it certainly will be with a double row of screws, no doubt 'bout it!

HTH,
 
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