How many months should I wait?

[switchman]

It is kinda expensive, isn't it? Especially for something that can't achieve 'perfection'.

Besides, my perfection is different than yours, or likely anyone else's. I am not anti-PLEK, though, I am just a 'find a great tech you know and trust and will listen to what you need' kinda guy.

Plek...Good topic for an insomniac I totally agree I'm not against it when used for its intended purpose but its gotten distorted over time.

Way back when, Plek started out as a mass production machine for factories. To Martin or GIbson or even Collings and Suhr the idea was for a massive up front investment in 21st century tech, you'll eventually get highly repeatable results in a fraction of the time, without worrying about variable results from even the best human doing fine detail handwork...once you get passed the machine's learning curve. I get this angle, but it's also used by some companies to hide their poor mass production methods like installing frets in the board before its even glued on the neck. It's really no different than the argument for a CNC vs. pin routers and shapers. A machine is doing what used to be done by human hands, but a human still has to program the right parameters to get proper results.

Anyhoo, the difference is that no one buys a CNC for repair purposes. But with Plek, Joe Glaser who has a wide reputation among building, repair, and the total Nashville scene was involved very early. I remember the store getting cold calls trying to sign up new service centers like Buzzy Feiten would, or every new whiz bang guitar, bass, and amp maker trying to build out a dealer network.

Fast forward years later...now Sweetwater offers Plek as an aftermarket upsell on new guitars. From their website "Unless a guitar comes from the manufacturer already Plek'd, nearly all guitars will see a dramatic improvement in setup and playability after undergoing the Plek process at Sweetwater."

This just doesn't sit well with me. You can see where posts like the OP come from. Now it's gone from Plek is a high volume factory time saving and quality improvement fretwork tool to Plek is an overall setup upgrade process over non-Plek which is implied to be inferior. I guess at different price points lower quality is to be expected but I thought proper fretwork and setup is a required feature on new guitars, not an upgrade.

 

[80's_Metal]

Does a PLEK setup guarantee absolute perfection? No doubt it is accurate...but as someone who hasn't had one of those setups, is it that perfect?

I don't know much, but the Plek'd Gibbys I have owned have never needed any setup outside of intonation.
And never a buzz that I can recall.

 

[Artie]

Take my comments with a grain 'o salt, 'cause I'm not a luthier, but one who has spent years watching, and talking, to my luthier friend as he did setups.
So, cobbled from conversations with him:

1. He's not a fan of the Plek process. At least, after the factory. For one, it does its job without the neck being under string tension.

2. You don't really check for fret level by hearing, or not hearing a buzz. That could be a truss rod, or bridge adjustment. He checks fret level by going back and forth, and up and down the entire neck, with one of those trapezoidal "rocker" tools. He finds high and low points, and adjusts accordingly.

 

[ehdwuld]

I don't know much, but the Plek'd Gibbys I have owned have never needed any setup outside of intonation.
And never a buzz that I can recall.

But you got used ones right?

Mine was new fresh from the factory

Yours had been owned at least once
And someone before you did all the other stuff

Paul Reed Smith talked about vintage guitars that way

We all thing vintage guitars were great
Because modern examples have been to the tech and played

 

[switchman]

The field version Plek Station does scan the guitar under string tension and records the results of each fret. So the theory is, if it records under string tension that for example fret #7 is .0015" too high, then it can remove that amount from the fret top without string tension and it still measures what it should afterwards. I think that's fair.

I do agree with #2 though. I found this statement from San Franciso Guitarworks pretty interesting.. shows the dillemma of selling any new product.

"We fully stand behind our previous work on the neck jig. In fact, we’ve checked our fretwork on the Plek and it’s stellar."

It's not like every fret job done without Plek is deficient. Do frets need to be levelled down to the Plek's extreme tolerance of .01mm / .0004" for the guitar to play well? No, not even close.

 

[Artie]

The field version Plek Station does scan the guitar under string tension and records the results of each fret. So the theory is, if it records under string tension that for example fret #7 is .0015" too high, then it can remove that amount from the fret top without string tension and it still measures what it should afterwards. I think that's fair.

That is fair. Good info.

 

[Mincer]

The Plek is fretwork, right? I mean, can you tell it you want the action a certain number of mm at a particular fret?

 

[ehdwuld]

It cuts the nut as well I think

Squares it off

That machine don't do rounded corners real good

 

[switchman]

The Plek is fretwork, right? I mean, can you tell it you want the action a certain number of mm at a particular fret?

Yes it's fretwork. The way I think of it, the goal is to make the fret tops and nut string slots perfectly level and aligned under string tension (real or simulated). So after that the action and relief can be set to player preference a low as possible if that's what they want. Then you know the only limit is string mechanics and how hard someone hits the strings. There's no worrying about a high fret somewhere to work around. Which again, is the same thing a really good human fret level does too.. This also assumes the machine operator is using it right

 

[80's_Metal]

But you got used ones right?

Mine was new fresh from the factory

Yours had been owned at least once
And someone before you did all the other stuff

Paul Reed Smith talked about vintage guitars that way

We all thing vintage guitars were great
Because modern examples have been to the tech and played

One of the 10 or so was brand new.

But yes the others were used and probably set up by someone else.
It might be worth noting that all but one of my Plek'd Gibbys have been drastically changed, in that they went from playing 9s in standard tuning to Drop B and beefy slinky's. I don't think I had to do any adjustments or had any buzzing that I recall from any of them.
I've been very pleased with that, and if it's because they were Plek'd, that makes me a huge fan.

 

[Clint 55]

That machine don't do rounded corners real good

Yep, you have to take the guitar to a good luthe (not Goob) if you want rounded fret ends.

 

[ehdwuld]

Yep, you have to take the guitar to a good luthe (not Goob) if you want rounded fret ends.

Be nice Clint

 

[Masta' C]

Does a PLEK setup guarantee absolute perfection? No doubt it is accurate...but as someone who hasn't had one of those setups, is it that perfect?

That's kind of a loaded question, simply because "perfection" might mean something different to everyone.

On one hand, yes, the Plek is incredibly accurate, just as you mentioned. It can "see" things the human eye can not. It can also do things beyond what most luthiers with simple jigs can do.

However, there's a lot that goes into the preparation and final setup following a Plek that still requires a significant "human" effort, knowledge, and skill.

A well-Plek'd guitar that receives a final end dressing and polish from a knowledgeable, competent luthier is arguably the best you're going to get.

But a bad luthier or tech could potentially mess up a good Plek job, so simply getting a "Plek" doesn't necessarily guarantee that you're actually getting "perfection".

 

[ICTGoober]

I can do rounded frets, but they don't help the player do any better. It's just luthiers showing off to each other. Many people don't even notice.

 

[Mincer]

That's kind of a loaded question, simply because "perfection" might mean something different to everyone.

On one hand, yes, the Plek is incredibly accurate, just as you mentioned. It can "see" things the human eye can not. It can also do things beyond what most luthiers with simple jigs can do.

However, there's a lot that goes into the preparation and final setup following a Plek that still requires a significant "human" effort, knowledge, and skill.

A well-Plek'd guitar that receives a final end dressing and polish from a knowledgeable, competent luthier is arguably the best you're going to get.

But a bad luthier or tech could potentially mess up a good Plek job, so simply getting a "Plek" doesn't necessarily guarantee that you're actually getting "perfection".

My point being, that the 'best' setup for you might be a Plek machine followed by skilled hands that can listen to you and tweak other non-fret level things to your preference. For the best setups, ideally, you would have both things.

 

[switchman]

I can do rounded frets, but they don't help the player do any better. It's just luthiers showing off to each other. Many people don't even notice.

Yeah this always gets me. Like fretwork has become about showing it off in high res zoomed in photos not how it plays.

 

[ehdwuld]

I can do rounded frets, but they don't help the player do any better. It's just luthiers showing off to each other. Many people don't even notice.

I was thinking
the Crowning tool
Before mounting the frets should roll the ends jut nicely

Sure the power tools set up would hasten the task

 

[ICTGoober]

I was thinking the Crowning tool Before mounting the frets should roll the ends jut nicely

Then you have to devise a way to hold the fret.

It's like sleeping on a water bed - push down over here, comes up over there.

 

[ehdwuld]

I was thinking clamping the tool and "striking a match" with the fret

Or clamping the fret tang in a vise and "sawing" down

 

[Artie]

I can do rounded frets, but they don't help the player do any better. It's just luthiers showing off to each other. Many people don't even notice.

I have had a couple Squiers (Bullet or Affinity), where I could saw wood with the neck. It can affect playability in extreme cases.