I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

I have been buying cheap sets of used Epiphone G-400 (SG) pickups for years to install in student's guitars. If you take off the covers and clean off all the wax, they are great sounding pickups, considering you can get them for about 12 dollars each sometimes.
 
Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Mr. B said:
I have been buying cheap sets of used Epiphone G-400 (SG) pickups for years to install in student's guitars. If you take off the covers and clean off all the wax, they are great sounding pickups, considering you can get them for about 12 dollars each sometimes.
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It's unfortunate that my post was the last of page three because now it's that much harder to refer back to, but this is a DiMarzio Air Classic, a well regarded pickup, and it boasts a metric fuctkon of wax, and that doesn't seem to hinder it's good reputation. Do Duncans come from the factory with that much wax?

Are you absolutely sure the Epi pickups sound better after losing the wax? How did they improve exactly?


The classic DiMarzio Air Classic
m3Zkuir.jpg
 
Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

DreX said:
I've come across this thread a few times in Google searches about pickups and wax potting, people claiming a reason / the reason cheap humbuckers sound muffled or lifeless or whatever is because they "drown them in wax", so I was not expecting to find enough wax to make one of those small restaurant candles when I removed the covers from the fine, USA made DiMarzio Air Classics

m3Zkuir.jpg


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so it seems to me the reason stock Epiphone pickups are so lacking in teh toanal qualities has become a little less clear once again.
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WOW I am speechless... this not something I would expect from Dimarzio... Would not all that Wax interfere with their AIR technology .
 
Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

I had a gold covered '59 that was potted in a similar fashion. The other pickup in the set was potted more moderately though.

Jocelyn said:
WOW I am speechless... this not something I would expect from Dimarzio... Would not all that Wax interfere with their AIR technology .
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The AIR technology is about distancing as far as I know, not actual air.
 
Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

DreX said:
Are you absolutely sure the Epi pickups sound better after losing the wax? How did they improve exactly?
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It could be more a function of removing the covers and lowering the pole screws rather than the wax. I'd have to perform a controlled test to see which. The poles are always raised up really high above the bobbin though, and I know that can really change the tone.
 
Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

I took the cover off my Alternative 8 and there was very little wax, just enough to basically keep the cover from vibrating against the coils and baseplate.
 
Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

Re: I have discovered why the Epiphone Pickups suck!!!

A couple of the reasons SDs have less wax than some others are as follows: SD deep draw tools their own covers which are designed to fit snug over the bobbins and not leave a lot of air space for the wax to fill. Second, the process SD uses to attach the covers involves a clamp that really compresses the pickup into the cover while the cover is being soldered on. These two things create less air voids that lead to less wax build-up.

BTW, we don't talk about competitor's products "sucking" here. We try to be more objective in our criticism. Showing the wax is fine. Speculating that more wax means a poorly constructed pickup is fine. Using the word "suck" is a slag. I never noticed this thread before, but I changed the title slightly to remove that word. Please keep that in mind. Thank you.
 
Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

:lol: "AIR Technology" :lol:

Please, call it something besides "Technology" :lol:
 
Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

SnakeAces said:
Whoa. I think the title of this thread changed
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see post number 67

Evan Skopp said:
BTW, we don't talk about competitor's products "sucking" here. We try to be more objective in our criticism. Showing the wax is fine. Speculating that more wax means a poorly constructed pickup is fine. Using the word "suck" is a slag. I never noticed this thread before, but I changed the title slightly to remove that word. Please keep that in mind. Thank you.
Click to expand...
 
Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

[Sarcasm On]
Well, wax in pickups is surely a delicate thing.

Best is not to pot at all - it tends to give a potty sound (and the original PAFs weren't potted - and they are the holy grail of sound!)

But if you are one of these evil high gain players:
Use bees wax as it makes the sound more warm and natural - always do the potting when the moon is waning. Its also good when a virgin is operating the vacuum pump, but these are increasingly hard to find. :11:
[Sarcasm off]
 
Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

All that wax reminds me of my ex.
 
Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

Would have agreed a few years back when this thread was new but the newer designed Epi stuff is quite a bit better, while certainly not quite on the level of a "name brand" US OE or aftermarket pickup they're certainly as good or better than the imported aftermarket stuff.

Personally I own a few Epiphones and have or am in the process of swapping to Duncan, DiMarzio, or Gibson pickups- I like them better but wouldn't call the current ProBuckers, for example, garbage - theyre a lot better than the previous stuff.

Only reason I bothered to comment was that it doesn't seem to show much class to rant about it after Evan taking the time to change the title of the the thread and gently remind posters of the forum rules
 
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Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

I believe the newer models have pickups from Korea, similar to the Artec-made GFSs. I agree the Epi P90s have traditionally been a bit better than their HBs. I have a Wildkat that sounds pretty good with the stock P90s, although I'll probably replace the cheap pots. I have two recent Epi guitars with stock HBs that don't sound too awful- less than stellar, but not terrible. I'm thinking about removing a bit of wax inside and see if they can't be made a bit better. Both bridge PUs read around 14K and they lack definition and bite when compared to better quality pickups. I had considered swapping the mags out for A3s, but I've been told weak mags in overwound HBs are generally not a good match. Thought about experimenting with removing some winds, but now I'm thinking that if the materials aren't great and the winding isn't either, even that probably wouldn't make them sound wonderful. So if de-waxing doesn't help, I may just sell 'em.
 
Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

eclecticsynergy said:
I have two recent Epi guitars with stock HBs Both bridge PUs read around 14K
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Epi p'ups with that reading having brass baseplates are the HOTCH model, which is arguably considered the worst stock p'up known to mankind. And to be clear, wax is the smallest of all tonal problems with that p'up and its neck companion, the 57CH. ;)

The only use I can see for those is as fancy paperweight. And yes, they are THAT BAD.

OTOH, the Alnico Classic Pro and Probucker series, although not being stellar, are quite usable, and can even sound good with the "right" modding.

I've documented the modding of the Alnico Classic Pros that came with my Epi Es-339 Pro.

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/sho...rs-A-close-view-pt-1&highlight=Epi+Probuckers

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/sho...rs-A-close-view-pt-2&highlight=Epi+Probuckers

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/sho...ng-the-job-done-pt-1&highlight=Epi+Probuckers

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/showthread.php?265684-Epi-Probuckers-DONE!&highlight=Epi+Probuckers

Since then, I've come in contact with other alloys that might work even better for the task ahead; I'll be revisiting this instrument when I'll be on vacation in August. If my recording skills raise to par, I'll be taking samples before and after.

For the record, I've been using it as the main instrument in my Smooth Jazz band project to this day.

HTH,
 
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Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

Ah, OK. I thought the really terrible ones were the Chinese PUs they stopped using some years ago. I guess I'll just replace these without bothering with the wax (whixh sounded like a pain to remove anyway). Will have to decide what to do about the corresponding neck pickups, which are a bit better, though they're still sort of... wooly. They read 8.6 and 8.9. The 8.6 one is the better of the two, perhaps because it's paired with a fairly bright guitar.

Kojak, I remember somebody posting that they'd had good results using A8 mags in humbuckers that weren't wound particularly hot, like 59s and T-tops. Was that you? And if so, do you think these so-so neck pickups might sound decent if I put an A3 into the 8.6K pickup to use at the neck and an A8 (or even a ceramic8) into the 8.9K pickup for use in bridge position?
 
Re: I have discovered the Epiphone Pickups have a lot of wax!!!

eclecticsynergy said:
Will have to decide what to do about the corresponding neck pickups, which are a bit better, though they're still sort of... wooly. They read 8.6 and 8.9. The 8.6 one is the better of the two, perhaps because it's paired with a fairly bright guitar.
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Don't bother. Even though they're "better" as bridge p'ups with either an A4 and/or an A8, "better" doesn't reach "good". "Bearable" is a better word for it. Also, even though finding suitable matching neck p'up is possible, it's just not easy or even cost-effective.

The lowest-cost/best tone solution, IME, is to get the Vintage Blues set and mod'em with an A4/A8 mag set for versatilty, or an A3/A2 mag set for Vintage-y vibe with clarity and harmonic complexity.

HTH,
 
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