Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

People who buy Toyotas think "Wow this is a nice car" until the accelerator sticks and they're seen flying down the highway passing everything in sight with their brake lights on.

The same thing for guitarists who buy Ibanezes. They think "Wow this is a nice guitar" and then they realize the truth.......Ibeenhad lol....just kidding, I like me some Ibby's!
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

. . . is Ibanez "Chrysler"? Is my analogy too far into left field?

I'm really liking Ibanez guitars the more I get my hands on them. Have they earned their position beside the "Big 2"? (Should I be calling Fender and Gibson the "Big 2"?) Have they always been there? Is there someone else more worthy?

What say yee?

Artie

One could easily argue for a big four: fender, gibson, ibanez and prs.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

People who buy Toyotas think "Wow this is a nice car" until the accelerator sticks and they're seen flying down the highway passing everything in sight with their brake lights on.

The same thing for guitarists who buy Ibanezes. They think "Wow this is a nice guitar" and then they realize the truth.......Ibeenhad lol....just kidding, I like me some Ibby's!

Turned out not to be a real issue for toyota, although many ppl with a stake in the auto biz wished otherwise.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

Turned out not to be a real issue for toyota, although many ppl with a stake in the auto biz wished otherwise.


That gas pedal sticking thing actually happened more than once. Prius was the most recent if I recall......No pun intended (recall).

Also Lexus, the parent company, had one instance a couple years ago and I remember them blaming the Lexus floor mats covering the pedals.

I was like: "note to self, stay away from Toyota and Lexus" And I always have.:biglaugh:
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

Ditching the car analogy for a second, I've always thought Ibanez makes premium instruments at all levels, barring the recent Gio line. You can pick up almost any $200+ Ibanez, and for its price, get something that rivals the quality of guitars in a bracket or two higher. Their resale value is low, which I've never understood, because this goes doubly so for the used Ibanez market. Pick up a 470 for $200? I've done it, and I love that guitar more than most new guitars under $1,000.

So where does that bring us back to in the car analogy? I think of Toyota when I think of a car that is quality along the entire price spectrum, from Yaris to Scion/Lexus branded sports/luxury vehicles. Just my 2c.

Great point. When Peavey hit the market, they took out an ad that showed a gibson and fender price tag and asked "why?"
Not that I love Peavey, but since then, many excellent, affordable guitars have entered the market. Gibson guitars are just too pricey to be a player's guitar.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

I think Washburn or Peavey would be the Chrysler of the guitar world

with PRS being the affordable hobby sport car


Ibanez = Toyota

Rondo / Xaviere = hyundai and Kia
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

I have never played an Ibanez RG that didn't feel like a Squier showman.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

I have never played an Ibanez RG that didn't feel like a Squier showman.

I agree with you about the RG's in the $200-$600 range but the Prestige RG's are super nice unless you hate flat necks. The Wizard II necks are real thin and wide. I like 'em although I don't own an Ibby...........yet.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

I think that, despite how good Ibanez is, the weight of the cultural heritage of big US makers like Fender or Gibson will always make them more prominent. This is partly to do with the eras that both companies are associated with, development of popular music being the main thing. Ibanez began as making (very good) copies of the big boys, and went on, in the 80s to find their own style and appeal, but it's not quite of the same impetus as the associations F & G have, which have had broader socio-cultural significance, I think.

Anyone can make an excellent guitar, regardless of whether they're in Japan or the west, if given the right incentives and environment. I think Ibanez can make a production guitar as good as anyone, it's a matter of taste. I play old 80s ones because they have features I like, are an excellent platform for mods, and the upper range models have some ritzy stuff, like nice ebony boards etc. So many people associate Ibanez with RGs and Jems that it's easy to forget how much variety there was/is.

I think this fits right back into the car analogy. Fender and Gibson are big American names with long established heritage of American made instruments dating back in the early 1900s. They're seen iconically throughout historical media, from music to movies, advertisements for unrelated things (sexy people holding sexy instruments), etc. Cars worked much the same way, for Ford and Chevy, and both industries saw radical changes with the advent of imports. Guitars/Cars made in foreign countries, some high quality (Japan) others not so trustworthy (China). Ibanez will never be as iconic as 'the big two', but today is there any thing that means a high end Prestige/J Custom/J Craft Ibanez isn't as good as an American deluxe Strat, Les Paul Custom etc? Preference. I can have a Mustang, but I drive a Scion FR-S. I could have a Gibson Les Paul, but I would rather drive a J-Custom ;)
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

No, no, no, NO, NO!!!!!

Ibanez == Honda, not Toy Yoda.

nope.
Honda = decent, if not boring, base models, the meh SI and horrifyingly lame and ugly upmarket Acuras. Also, nothing for the 18-25 demographic.
Toyota = decent and slightly less boring base models, their upmarket machines (Lexus) are nice, and they have Scions for kiddies.

Ibanez = RGs that Camry it along pretty well, Prestiges that are nice, and Gios for kids. Toyota also makes good, yet not standout trucks, which are obviously basses.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

Ditching the car analogy for a second, I've always thought Ibanez makes premium instruments at all levels, barring the recent Gio line. You can pick up almost any $200+ Ibanez, and for its price, get something that rivals the quality of guitars in a bracket or two higher. Their resale value is low, which I've never understood, because this goes doubly so for the used Ibanez market. Pick up a 470 for $200? I've done it, and I love that guitar more than most new guitars under $1,000.

So where does that bring us back to in the car analogy? I think of Toyota when I think of a car that is quality along the entire price spectrum, from Yaris to Scion/Lexus branded sports/luxury vehicles. Just my 2c.

I guess Toyota Supra is Ibanez.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

Ibanez will never be as iconic as 'the big two', but today is there any thing that means a high end Prestige/J Custom/J Craft Ibanez isn't as good as an American deluxe Strat, Les Paul Custom etc? Preference. I can have a Mustang, but I drive a Scion FR-S. I could have a Gibson Les Paul, but I would rather drive a J-Custom ;)

Ibanez is already as big (if not bigger than) as Fender and Gibson. Fenders and Gibsons are like 'your dad's Cadillac' while Ibanez is 'the present', that's why you rarely see avant-garde/ modern players choose Gibson or Fender, but Ibanez or something on par like ESP. Ibanez seems to keep innovating and listen to its consumers with expansive product lines that are evolving, while the other two seem to stuck with LP and Strat.
 
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Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

Ibanez seems to keep innovating

Excusez-moi, but I don't think the guitar building business ever saw another innovator of the same caliber as Gibson and Fender.

I mean, look: Gibson invented the solid body guitar. Well, it wasn't before Bigsby's Merle Travis, but the Les Paul, they made it right. Then they made it right four more times with the Explorer, the Flying V, the SG and the Firebird. They invented pointy guitars before they were cool, they invented "shred" with the idea of "the fastest neck in the world" and easy upper fret access, they invented beveled body edges, tune-o-matics and humbuckers.

Fender reinvented the solid body guitar. Every second guitar made today draws from the Stratocaster. Leo's ideas of the bolt-on construction, the stratocaster's comfort contoured body, its tremolo bridge design and pickguard-mounted electronics were highly original and caught on. Then they invented the bass guitar.

While Fender successfully pulled off mass production (like Ford but without any color you wanted being black), Gibson made themselves the strongest, most iconic brand in the industry, just like Ferrari. And guess what happened - one day, out of nowhere, there came a man who didn't find Enzo's cars good enough. Blasphemy! He believed he could build a better sports car than the number one name. That was almost an impossible challenge, yet he didn't quite fail miserably! That man was a tractor builder named Ferruccio Lamborghini and the rest is history.

That's how Bernardo Rico came to the scene - a flamenco luthier of mexican descent with a vision on "how to build a better Gibson". Except he didn't really build Gibsons but something quite different, just like Lamborghini didn't build road legal race cars but grand tourers. BC Rich didn't follow Gibson's formulas but made up their own instead. Heelless neck through body construction, exotic wood, avantgarde shapes, 24 fret fingerboards, complex tone circuits, 10 strings and unconventional finishes have been their distinctive features.

Another innovators worth mentioning are Ned Steinberger with his headless instruments made of graphite, and whoever designed the aluminum necked Kramers. Eddie Van Halen invented one superstrat formula, Grover Jackson did another one, and the Randy Rhoads.

Now what would be Ibanez's radical invention? I'd say maybe the lens-profiled Saber body shape, swirled finishes, and most importantly seven/eight string guitars available to mere mortals. But I don't think they ever went beyond mashing up and modifying existing designs. Even more of that can be said about ESP: they can make some great quality guitars, it's just their design ideas aren't original at all.
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

Excusez-moi, but I don't think the guitar building business ever saw another innovator of the same caliber as Gibson and Fender.

I mean, look: Gibson invented the solid body guitar. Well, it wasn't before Bigsby's Merle Travis, but the Les Paul, they made it right. Then they made it right four more times with the Explorer, the Flying V, the SG and the Firebird. They invented pointy guitars before they were cool, they invented "shred" with the idea of "the fastest neck in the world" and easy upper fret access, they invented beveled body edges, tune-o-matics and humbuckers.

Fender reinvented the solid body guitar. Every second guitar made today draws from the Stratocaster. Leo's ideas of the bolt-on construction, the stratocaster's comfort contoured body, its tremolo bridge design and pickguard-mounted electronics were highly original and caught on. Then they invented the bass guitar.

While Fender successfully pulled off mass production (like Ford but without any color you wanted being black), Gibson made themselves the strongest, most iconic brand in the industry, just like Ferrari. And guess what happened - one day, out of nowhere, there came a man who didn't find Enzo's cars good enough. Blasphemy! He believed he could build a better sports car than the number one name. That was almost an impossible challenge, yet he didn't quite fail miserably! That man was a tractor builder named Ferruccio Lamborghini and the rest is history.

That's how Bernardo Rico came to the scene - a flamenco luthier of mexican descent with a vision on "how to build a better Gibson". Except he didn't really build Gibsons but something quite different, just like Lamborghini didn't build road legal race cars but grand tourers. BC Rich didn't follow Gibson's formulas but made up their own instead. Heelless neck through body construction, exotic wood, avantgarde shapes, 24 fret fingerboards, complex tone circuits, 10 strings and unconventional finishes have been their distinctive features.

Another innovators worth mentioning are Ned Steinberger with his headless instruments made of graphite, and whoever designed the aluminum necked Kramers. Eddie Van Halen invented one superstrat formula, Grover Jackson did another one, and the Randy Rhoads.

Now what would be Ibanez's radical invention? I'd say maybe the lens-profiled Saber body shape, swirled finishes, and most importantly seven/eight string guitars available to mere mortals. But I don't think they ever went beyond mashing up and modifying existing designs. Even more of that can be said about ESP: they can make some great quality guitars, it's just their design ideas aren't original at all.

"I put 4 wheels and an engine under a steel body, I am now responsible for all innovations and technological wonders for the rest of humanity's time with the automobile"

"I stole a design from a buddy and profited from it and now LOOK IT TUNES ITSELF SORTA AND YOU CAN NOW GET IT IN GREEN"

"I can't play guitar very well and want to make cheap guitars with cheap woods and bolt-on necks to maximize profit AND LOOK THIS GUITAR IS ALSO BLACK WITH A WHITE PICKGUARD BUT SOMEONE FAMOUS PLAYS SOMETHING LIKE IT SO ITS A MAGNITUDE MORE EXPENSIVE"
 
Re: Ibanez? If Fender and Gibson are Chevy and Ford . . .

I was thinking Ibanez is Nissan, ESP is Toyota, and Schecter is Hyundai (or maybe Kia?).
 
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