Modeling amp technology still lagging

[Mr. B]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I remember playing a flextone when I bought my old Vox AD60VT. The flextone had more features, but I thought the Vox sounds were more immediately authentic. Could be that, if you dug into the Flextone, it had models that sound just as good, but it was much less user friendly, so I went with the Vox.

 

[Mr. B]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

The guitarist for Megadeath is touring using the Axe-fx for what it's worth.

I think you mean they are touring using the Digitech GSP1101, right?

 

[innerdreamrecords.co]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

^ I posted the Youtube videos I saw in this thread. Are those old?

 

[crguti]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I'm not into modeling but I checked the Rocktron Voodu-Valve and it's very sweet. I'm gasing one right now. ... man, the gas never ends.

 

[cakire82]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

The Digitech GSP 1101 sounds more authentic to me. I didn't know about that one. The dry amp clips on their site sound pretty good.

Dave Mustaine is touring with a Digitech GSP 1101 ($500)
Chris is touring with Axe-Fx Ultra ($2000)

They are both using Marshal EL34 100/100 dual mono block all tube power amp.

 

[Thunder7]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I stopped in a Guitar Center a few weeks ago and every amp on the floor was a modeler, all the tube amps were in the "sound room." I don't have anything against modelers, solid state or tube. I have a Spider Valve, have had one for a few years now, it's the original model. I don't know about how closely it models other amps but I get my sound out of it and that's what matters. I've got it biased a lot hotter and just spent a lot of time EQ'ing and now I've got all the sounds that I need. I think if modeling amps marketed themselves as more of a stand alone type of thing instead of "we sound like (insert amp names here) cause are models are teh awesome," the reception would be a lot different.

 

[Gr8Scott]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

The blue grill vox is very nice indeed, but it has EQ issues to my ears. It seems to like different speakers for different models. It is great if you have a buttload of cabs to use, but it needs a bit of tweaking here and there for it to be 100% accurate IMHO. I do think it's the best out there excepting the Fractal Audio stuff of course. It is definitely better than the silver grill Vox modelers I've encountered and it beats the pants off of anything that I've heard from anyone else.

 

[eschoendorff]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

The guitarist for Megadeath is touring using the Axe-fx for what it's worth.

Actually, he and Mustaine were both using the GSP1101 before the Fractal unit.

I liked their live sound enough to try out an RP1000 (the GSP's cousin) and I was sold. The thing sounds damn good through my PA. But not enough to make me sell my Marshall and Mesa gear. It's just a different tool for a different job.

 

[Hellion]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I haven't recorded a CD in the last 5 years with anything other than a POD. They're a nice sounding unit. No, they'll never put Marshall, Fender, Vox, Randall, et al, out of business, but if you're looking for a particular sound and don't have the budget for every amp your heart desires, they'll do the job.

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I've had the POD and XTL, and still have a Line6 AM-4 pedal (amp models without all the effects and whatnot - plug-n-go modeling), and the 1101.

While I haven't had the amps they purport to replicate, you're always going to find the drastic differences between a rack unit going into a mixer and out the nearfield monitors vs a head+cabinet with 12" speakers in it. Period.

However, if you mic the 100w all tube head and 4x12 cabinet setup with an SM57 and MD421 into a console, chances are pretty good that once it's mixed with a band the modeler is going to sound just like it when both tracks are played back through the studio monitors, and through someone's iPod.

What I want from a modeler is not a smorgasbord of "famous name" models as picked by the developer's notion of which amps define a given brand name, but the things that define the sound those names are famous for.

I don't want a Marshall JCM800 model, I want models of what makes the JCM800 so special. What makes it so different from the JTM800 or JCM900 or the ones before the JCM800? What makes a Non-Master-Volume Marshall head so much better than a Master-Volume head? What makes a Vox AC-30 TopBoost better than any other Vox model? WHat makes the Roland JC120 so great?

Put those elements in a model package so I can mix-n-match. Not simply preamp models, but the more in-depth stuff like Germanium capacitors (with adjustable aging/leaking settings so you get that "just before it craps out" sound). Let me choose the tube models - 12AT7, 12AY7, or 12AX7, or all 3 if I want. Let me choose what power tube models are used, not just the poweramp model.

Put an old Neve console strip model in the Direct Out path so that no matter what I'm running into to record, it sounds like I'm recording through a vintage Neve console.

The OP is right - modeling has stagnated. Everyone does the same models, and each one has their own interpretation of those models, so Line6's 83 JCM800 doesn't sound like Digitech's 83 JCM800.

 

[DankStar]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

if peavey had somehow incorporated revalver tones into an amp, I think they would have made a worthy contender.

 

[JeffB]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I think Vox has got the most realistic tube "feel" & "warmth". In fact they are the only ones really. Most (but not all) of the models are pretty decent facsimiles of the originals (some very good, some not very good at all). But none of the brands yet have done a convincing Marshall Plexi- they can do pretty good for Fenders, Voxes, Mesas, but marshalls in general just never sound right in person- the vox 800 is not bad, but the plexi, jubilee, JVM & 900...yuck. The Line 6 & Roland plexis are plastic sounding junk.

Worse, all digital modellers feel like crap to play through, make nearly every guitar sound alike, and have little to no "real amp" dynamics. Maybe not a big deal for trying to get a sound in a studio track, but a big deal for many players, myself included.

But def stagnant. At the same time though- they are trying to occupy a price point, and why would Vox, Fender, Marshall, etc offer Modelling amps SO GOOD, that it competes with their authentic tube amps- not only for tone, but pricing. Wouldn't make sense, and likely the reason Vox killed it's blue grill line (and that whiz bang vaporware modelling amp to replace it).

 

[ImmortalSix]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I think Vox has got the most realistic tube "feel" & "warmth".

Me too. Check out some of my YouTube videos with the AD15VT; they sound pretty doggone good.

Single Coils


P90s


Humbuckers

 

[DankStar]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

Dave Mustaine is touring with a Digitech GSP 1101 ($500)

I thought Dave just said on here during the chat he was using marshall again cause they "sound the best right out of the box."

 

[Tor]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

Wonder how many that writes off modeling have actually tried the "state of the art" AxeFXs..

 

[Binnerscot]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

Wonder how many that writes off modeling have actually tried the "state of the art" AxeFXs..

I wouldn't write it off as useful, but as a stand alone preamp?

I just haven't heard anything natural out of it for mid gain and high gain tones....solid state and digital have done good clean tones for years....that doesn't impress me.

If it doesn't come across well in clips (amateur to pro level), do you think I want to stand in front of it and say, this is awesome but sounds like crap when recorded!...I can't even imagine that happening.

I think it is a stellar effects unit, but it is flavor of the month for a pre-amp.

 

[cakire82]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I thought Dave just said on here during the chat he was using marshall again cause they "sound the best right out of the box."

He is using it with a Marshall power amp and cabinet during touring only.

He mentioned in an interview he is used tube heads for the last album's recording. RR model and the JVM410H if I remember correct.
1101 rig was only used during the touring because it made it easy for them to replicated sounds from previous albums.

 

[DankStar]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

He is using it with a Marshall power amp and cabinet during touring only.

He mentioned in an interview he is used tube heads for the last album's recording. RR model and the JVM410H if I remember correct.
1101 rig was only used during the touring because it made it easy for them to replicated sounds from previous albums.

ahhh, thanks

 

[LtKojak]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

I can't believe NOBODY mentioned the best of all hardware modelers: Digidesign's Eleven rack.

It eats the AxeFx for lunch and then some. I've used with a Mesa Boogie 20/20 amp to a stereo wired open cab with two Celestion G12-65.

I just couldn't believe how close to a real amp it behaved! It was like having twelve of the best fine-tuned boutique amps at your fingertips. And it's even cheaper than the AxeFx!

 

[eschoendorff]

Re: Modeling amp technology still lagging

Me too. Check out some of my YouTube videos with the AD15VT; they sound pretty doggone good.

Wow... you really look alot different in the videos than you do in your avatar!



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