Rockstar216
New member
Might want to read this before you spend all that money on over priced caps and pots.
http://www.aqdi.com/tonecap.htm
http://www.aqdi.com/tonecap.htm
Myth busted on capacitors and tone
- Thread starter Rockstar216
- Start date
Myaccount876
Amira-Maker
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
The graphs in the link show that there is a difference, although quite minuscule and very possibly within the margin of testing error. If someone can hear the difference, good for them. I sure can't, and I'm not going to burn the money on expensive caps. Not really an issue of "right way" or "wrong way".
The graphs in the link show that there is a difference, although quite minuscule and very possibly within the margin of testing error. If someone can hear the difference, good for them. I sure can't, and I'm not going to burn the money on expensive caps. Not really an issue of "right way" or "wrong way".
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
I do absolutely believe that the difference in style and brand (excluding actual values) of caps have no effect at all on tone, BUT, after seeing this on their website, I really have an issue with these people.
" There's a reason why you don't find engineers and physicists buying $100 speaker cables."
THEN:
http://www.aqdi.com/zerocap.htm#link9
I do absolutely believe that the difference in style and brand (excluding actual values) of caps have no effect at all on tone, BUT, after seeing this on their website, I really have an issue with these people.
" There's a reason why you don't find engineers and physicists buying $100 speaker cables."
THEN:
http://www.aqdi.com/zerocap.htm#link9
Rockstar216
New member
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
Ill pay for that before I would a high cap cable but I like what a Low cap cable does to the tone and the transparency it brings. I can hear the difference between those two types of cables but capacitors on the other hand, other then diff values I can hear no difference between caps of the same value. But I doubt that going to stop people from paying large amounts of money for them.
Ill pay for that before I would a high cap cable but I like what a Low cap cable does to the tone and the transparency it brings. I can hear the difference between those two types of cables but capacitors on the other hand, other then diff values I can hear no difference between caps of the same value. But I doubt that going to stop people from paying large amounts of money for them.
David Collins
New member
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
It's an old argument is as likely to end as ones on homeopathy and phrenology. If you have a half hour to waste (or feel free to skim through, as it's really not that exciting), I did make a few videos on this some time ago. The first is a listening test, which is really more of a small sample demonstration of how good listening tests can be arranged. I've done a good deal more surveying with a number of different rigs and arrangements, and scores of first-hand participants. The second video is a summary of the results.
http://youtu.be/817JHiYV_Po
http://youtu.be/M7Hu52vmxE0
As pointed to earlier though, although I happen to agree with the conclusions, the tests cited from AQDI should rightfully raise some concerns about motives, as they do have products to sell which are positioned as alternative enhancements to the products they are critical of. That said, cable capacitance does indeed affect a very notable difference in tone (clearly audible in blind tests and easily measurable). The fact that they have chips on the table here though, this can and perhaps should raise concerns over their ability to test and evaluate with complete objectivity.
It's an old argument is as likely to end as ones on homeopathy and phrenology. If you have a half hour to waste (or feel free to skim through, as it's really not that exciting), I did make a few videos on this some time ago. The first is a listening test, which is really more of a small sample demonstration of how good listening tests can be arranged. I've done a good deal more surveying with a number of different rigs and arrangements, and scores of first-hand participants. The second video is a summary of the results.
http://youtu.be/817JHiYV_Po
http://youtu.be/M7Hu52vmxE0
As pointed to earlier though, although I happen to agree with the conclusions, the tests cited from AQDI should rightfully raise some concerns about motives, as they do have products to sell which are positioned as alternative enhancements to the products they are critical of. That said, cable capacitance does indeed affect a very notable difference in tone (clearly audible in blind tests and easily measurable). The fact that they have chips on the table here though, this can and perhaps should raise concerns over their ability to test and evaluate with complete objectivity.
frankfalbo
In Fluence Y'all
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
The test and its results are useless. They're just asserting that the differences are within margins of tolerance, and insignificant. But think about how insignificant a tiny little mosquito is in the vast open space of a bedroom at night. If it's your bedroom, it's kind of a big deal.
Plus it completely ignores the effect the caps have over dynamic shifts, transients, etc. it's not the appropriate test for the desired data.
The test and its results are useless. They're just asserting that the differences are within margins of tolerance, and insignificant. But think about how insignificant a tiny little mosquito is in the vast open space of a bedroom at night. If it's your bedroom, it's kind of a big deal.
Plus it completely ignores the effect the caps have over dynamic shifts, transients, etc. it's not the appropriate test for the desired data.
Empty Pockets
BadHairDayologist
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
All of these numbers and charts and graphs and crap.
Shouldn't you guys be practicing guitar or something?
All of these numbers and charts and graphs and crap.
Shouldn't you guys be practicing guitar or something?
uOpt
Something Cool
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
The graphs show frequency distribution only, in total. If you really want to make this point you'd have to break it up by time.
The graphs show frequency distribution only, in total. If you really want to make this point you'd have to break it up by time.
Snake Aces
Singlecut Slut
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
I'll just keep buying Russian paper in oil caps. I can afford them, they look cool and they sound good to me.
I'll just keep buying Russian paper in oil caps. I can afford them, they look cool and they sound good to me.
PFDarkside
of the Forum
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
Dumb question, are these all NOS or still being production?
It seems as though capacitors and resistors make more of a difference as you step up from Guitar to Pedals to Amps.
Dumb question, are these all NOS or still being production?
It seems as though capacitors and resistors make more of a difference as you step up from Guitar to Pedals to Amps.
Snake Aces
Singlecut Slut
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
Every time I order some the listing says they are NOS. Not sure if that's true or not, but that's how they are listed.
I agree they make more of a difference on pedals and amps for sure.
Every time I order some the listing says they are NOS. Not sure if that's true or not, but that's how they are listed.
I agree they make more of a difference on pedals and amps for sure.
treyhaislip
Well-known member
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
I always thought of higher pots being able to handle output better and blend better (gotta love that grammar lol) I notice the "better" pots have a wider range on the volume, but I really don't use the tone knobs (I know, i'm a terrible person.)
Seems to me that many of this posts come down to the argument of a Kia and a Rolls Royce, some see the Kia as the only option because it gets you from A to B while others say if you can afford a Rolls Royce why not get the option with better handling, more comfortable drive, super nice interior, etc...
I don't think its a black and white issue of cheap pots are just as good/there's no difference...
I always thought of higher pots being able to handle output better and blend better (gotta love that grammar lol) I notice the "better" pots have a wider range on the volume, but I really don't use the tone knobs (I know, i'm a terrible person.)
Seems to me that many of this posts come down to the argument of a Kia and a Rolls Royce, some see the Kia as the only option because it gets you from A to B while others say if you can afford a Rolls Royce why not get the option with better handling, more comfortable drive, super nice interior, etc...
I don't think its a black and white issue of cheap pots are just as good/there's no difference...
ehdwuld
A Ficus
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
We had a thread about this some years ago
Someone posted a video of about 8 different caps
And sound clips of each
Heremetico , here, could hear some difference
I couldn't
One clip showed a bumblebee cap the got busted open to reveal a ceramic cap inside
I had put a pio in one of my earlier mods
But since seeing that
I just bought a dozen ceramics for a nickel each
*(Sent from my durned phone!)*
We had a thread about this some years ago
Someone posted a video of about 8 different caps
And sound clips of each
Heremetico , here, could hear some difference
I couldn't
One clip showed a bumblebee cap the got busted open to reveal a ceramic cap inside
I had put a pio in one of my earlier mods
But since seeing that
I just bought a dozen ceramics for a nickel each
*(Sent from my durned phone!)*
JOLLY
Super Simonologist
DreX
New member
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
Yeah that article is supposedly five years old now so this isn't exactly breaking news.
It's always comical to see a poetic retort to a technical argument.
This would mean the "slew rate", correct? "the maximum rate of change of output voltage per unit of time", at least with active amplification, slew rate becomes an increasing problem as the voltage gets higher. I'd think with the extremely low voltage of an electric guitar, the rate of voltage change across a capacitor would be amazingly tiny.
Yeah that article is supposedly five years old now so this isn't exactly breaking news.
It's always comical to see a poetic retort to a technical argument.
This would mean the "slew rate", correct? "the maximum rate of change of output voltage per unit of time", at least with active amplification, slew rate becomes an increasing problem as the voltage gets higher. I'd think with the extremely low voltage of an electric guitar, the rate of voltage change across a capacitor would be amazingly tiny.
DreX
New member
Re: Myth busted on capacitors and tone
Leo Fender should have heeded this advice when he was worrying about all those technical things too, rumor has it he couldn't even play guitar, he like, didn't practice at all.
I've never been convinced that spending time trying out different brands of capacitor would yield better results for my tone than spending the same amount of time practicing.
Leo Fender should have heeded this advice when he was worrying about all those technical things too, rumor has it he couldn't even play guitar, he like, didn't practice at all.
