Replacing Antiquity humbuckers
- Thread starter Bill Dennis
- Start date
Bill Dennis
New member
That's not really the point. They don't add turns to the originals as they age.
Lewguitar
New member
Well the simple truth is: PAF's were only 7 to 10 years old when the classic guitarists of the 60's used them to create the sounds a lot of us are still trying to get.
So why age a magnet to sound like it's 50 years old? The tones many of us are after were created when those magnets were less than 10 years old!
I think it's about the right alnico (2, 3, 4 or 5 depending on what you want to hear) and the right finish: roughcast/sandcast.
Not polished.
And, of course, the right copper wire and the right number of turns.
So why age a magnet to sound like it's 50 years old? The tones many of us are after were created when those magnets were less than 10 years old!
I think it's about the right alnico (2, 3, 4 or 5 depending on what you want to hear) and the right finish: roughcast/sandcast.
Not polished.
And, of course, the right copper wire and the right number of turns.
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Lewguitar
New member
In other words, degaussing the magnets to sound 50 years old is a waste of time if your goal is make a paf style pickup that gets the sounds Clapton, Beck, Kosoff, Green, Allman, Taylor, etc. got in 1967-70.
What you want is a NEW paf with NEW magnets that matches the specs of those now 50 year old pickups when they were NEW.
Because they were almost new when those recordings were made.
And you need a good Marshall. :1:
Bill Dennis
New member
If I wanted what they sounded like back then, that's what the Seth/59's PG etc are for. I don't understand your logic at all here. The whole point of the Ants is to sound old. Vintage LP is the sound I wanted. Whatever these are, I don't care for them
AllHailDIO
New member
:dunno: IDK... Maybe only degaussing didn't accomplish what SD wanted tonally so they added a little more turns.
All I know is I noticed Antiquity has a higher DC resistance with weaker magnets. Maybe I am wrong to assume it has more turns. Wouldn't be the first time I'd be wrong about something :knockedou
AllHailDIO
New member
I believe how SD markets this is... If you want PAF style tones to get near-accurate sounds of yester era, you would get the Seth Lover or 59
If you want PAF style tones akin to authentic PAFs, like say if you picked up a 1959 Les Paul and played it today, the Antiquity is inspired by that tonal direction.
Leon Of Late
New member
All I know is that Seymour is a genius when it comes to pickups, so if the Ant has higher DC resistance combined with the weaker magnets there are very specific engineering reasons that happened. The Antiquity is not for everyone, but it is an amazing pickup.
From the actual product page:
The Antiquity bridge humbucker delivers that open, airy tone of the great “P.A.F.” humbuckers that Seth Lover designed in 1955. High notes cut through without being overly bright, and low notes growl with spongy vintage warmth. We wind the bridge model a little hotter for better balance and added warmth, and, as with the neck model, we use the same custom hand-aging process to create an authentic vintage look and sound.
The Antiquity bridge humbucker delivers that open, airy tone of the great “P.A.F.” humbuckers that Seth Lover designed in 1955. High notes cut through without being overly bright, and low notes growl with spongy vintage warmth. We wind the bridge model a little hotter for better balance and added warmth, and, as with the neck model, we use the same custom hand-aging process to create an authentic vintage look and sound.
Lewguitar
New member
And they do look old. Even when you remove the covers, which is how I use mine.
And they do sound great! They're my favorite Duncan humbucker set and I have them in three guitars.
I'm thankful that unlike the original Gibson paf sets, the bridge Antiquity is wound a little hotter than the neck Antiquity. It's an improvement.
That was the only short coming of the originals: the neck pickup always sounds louder than the bridge pickup with Gibson guitars from the 50's and 60's..
That was an undesirable side effect of the original Gibson pafs in a set both being more or less identical, and not designed as a bridge or neck model.
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uOpt
Something Cool
Can you be more specific, such as by linking to the diagram you followed?
I am aware of 3 wiring schemes that are slightly different all commonly referred to as "50's wiring".
Lewguitar
New member
But those pickups use polished magnets. 50's pafs used sandcast/roughcast magnets. So the Seth Lover and 59 don't really sound like a Gibson PAF did when it was new.
I don't know if I agree with that either. To me, the Antiquity sounds more like the PAFs did when they were new.
I have owned some real 50's Gibsons. A '58 LP Sunburst, a '59 LP Sunburst, a 3 humbucker '59 LP Custom, a '58 ES-335, a '59 ES-335, a '60 ES-355...
Aside from the neck and bridge model Antiquity being calibrated so that the neck pickup is wound weaker than the bridge, the Antiquity sounds more like my favorite PAF humbuckers that I've actually owned than the 59, PG and Seth Lovers do.
However, the Custom Shop version of the PG's, which does use roughcast A2 magnets, does remind me of the 50's PAFs I've owned.
Again: the classic tones of guys like Mike Bloomfield, Peter Green, Eric Clapton, Jeff Beck, Mick Taylor, etc. were made in the late 1960's using PAF's that were 10 years old....not 50 years old.
And to me new Antiquitys get those tones better, at least partially because they use the "right" magnet, the "right" insulating coating on the 42 ga. copper wire, and because the winders must do something different that they don't do on the 59, Pg and Seth Lover.
Every pickup I've gotten from the Custom Shop has sounded better than the non-Custom Shop version.
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Leon Of Late
New member
This is a very accurate statement. I’ve had Custom Shop APHb @ 9k, S-Deco, Greenie Set, Brobucker, 59’n and just received a CS Pearly Gates set that I haven’t had a chance to install yet. Regardless, every CS pickup I have tried has been exceptional in its tone, clarity, openness, richness, etc. Except the Brobucker. It is a very thick pickup, at least in the guitars I have tried it in. I think I need to put it in a fat Strat though.
AllHailDIO
New member
I agree, I really love the Antiquity. They sound great and I imagine being CS definitely has a lot to do with it.
I unfortunately never tried a true PAF but interesting to hear your observation and insight.
TattooedCarrot
New member
I had the same complaint about Ants as the thread starter had. The smoothness of the degaussed magnet can also make it sound a bit too mellow and lack cut to some ears. I found that a full strength A2 made a whole new pickup out of it. It's a slightly hotter wind to copensate for the weaker stock magnet so putting a regular A2 in it gave it the umph it was lacking. One of my favorites.
Bill Dennis
New member
I have them out of the guitar. I have not decided what to do. I might modify, might sell.. if one or both are double cream, they will stay. 
both are old enough that it's possible. Not sure what i want to do yet.
both are old enough that it's possible. Not sure what i want to do yet.
Lewguitar
New member
I have them out of the guitar. I have not decided what to do. I might modify, might sell.. if one or both are double cream, they will stay.
If you want to sell them and they are unaltered and the price is right, let me know. Thanks
Bill Dennis
New member
Let me see what the market for them is.. they are not altered
