seymour duncan output specs

[WaR HeaD]

hi dudes...how are you doing?

i have always wondered why does only dimarzio include the output on their pickups, while duncans doesn´t...

i have read thousands of threads comparing them and emgs about output but i have never seen numbers on the comparison...

before the new web came duncans at least had some kind of output bar, but now it only shows if it has moderate output or high output...

do you have any clue or real specs of the output of the pups?

thanks a lot, have a nice day

 

[Robert Delahunt]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

hi dudes...how are you doing?

i have always wondered why does only dimarzio include the output on their pickups, while duncans doesn´t...

i have read thousands of threads comparing them and emgs about output but i have never seen numbers on the comparison...

before the new web came duncans at least had some kind of output bar, but now it only shows if it has moderate output or high output...

do you have any clue or real specs of the output of the pups?

thanks a lot, have a nice day

Output? Usually ohms is a good enough estimate, since the guitar gets wired into an amp and essentially becomes part of the circuit. Just my 2 cents anyways. More resistance = more power usually.

 

[Reckless Abandon]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

Milivolts are not always constant therefore not a perfect indicator of output. DC rest is not either since mag strength matters as well. Take DC rest, the mag, and milivolts if provided to decide and compare to dimarzio. Just trust Seymour when it say low, moderate, or high.

 

[theodie]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

Output? Usually ohms is a good enough estimate, since the guitar gets wired into an amp and essentially becomes part of the circuit. Just my 2 cents anyways. More resistance = more power usually.

Nope, one should not really pay attention to resistance and resistance only when trying to figure out how much a pickup has. It is part of the equation but, there are far more important factors.

 

[theodie]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

hi dudes...how are you doing?

i have always wondered why does only dimarzio include the output on their pickups, while duncans doesn´t...

i have read thousands of threads comparing them and emgs about output but i have never seen numbers on the comparison...

before the new web came duncans at least had some kind of output bar, but now it only shows if it has moderate output or high output...

do you have any clue or real specs of the output of the pups?

thanks a lot, have a nice day

What exactly are you looking to find out by looking at outputs?

 

[WaR HeaD]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

What exactly are you looking to find out by looking at outputs?

nothing special, it is just to have as much info as i can... i can trust seymour when the specs sais high output but i like to know really the milivolts, i know resistance, the magnet, etc can show how the pup is, but even more info would be helpful as well...

but btw i have seen dimarzio pups like the x2n, the evolution, a new one called the d-activator or something, the super 3, that seems to be too much hot... i don´t know if duncan pups like the dimebucker, the distortion, jb, custom, invader (i have got one set of live wires that these ones are the most powerfull pups on the market) have more or less output

 

[Zerberus]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

You can change a pickups output in millivolts by at least a dozen ways that have nothing whatsoever to do with the pickup. For example using a different pick, using different strings, using a differnet scale length, tuning lower.... If you can get a few dozen manufacturers to agree on an exact setup as the industry standard, the values might be worth the paper they´d be printed on. But I don´t think many manufacturers are going to jump on a bandwagon that Dimarzio built.

Output in mV is consistent at best among a single manufacturers line (this assumes that the exact same setup was always used). But "percieved output" as used by Duncan and others (So to speak "how hot does it sound") is IMO actually a better value, because it takes into account the fact that a different tonality can make a pickup sound hotter or cooler than it really is.

And to be honest, isn´t the way it sounds much more important than an arbitrary value with near zero comparison value outside of the brand?

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

If testing to determine a pickup's output in mV is done correctly, it could actually be extremely meaningful. What most of you who shout it down are assuming is that it's being tested by a guy playing the guitar. If that were the case, then yeah, it'd be extremely inconsistent. However, if they have a controlled method of doing it, say, anything besides a person, it'd be pretty accurate.

Given all the measures people go to with clean boosts and whatnot, I'll never understand why people treat it as a secondary issue.

 

[stangme01]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

Output? Usually ohms is a good enough estimate, since the guitar gets wired into an amp and essentially becomes part of the circuit. Just my 2 cents anyways. More resistance = more power usually.

not a good way to judge it at all.

Dimarzio really helps so much with their website i give them props. Thats why i'm gonna be switching to them for a while to check their pickups out.

 

[stangme01]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

You can change a pickups output in millivolts by at least a dozen ways that have nothing whatsoever to do with the pickup. For example using a different pick, using different strings, using a differnet scale length, tuning lower.... If you can get a few dozen manufacturers to agree on an exact setup as the industry standard, the values might be worth the paper they´d be printed on. But I don´t think many manufacturers are going to jump on a bandwagon that Dimarzio built.

Output in mV is consistent at best among a single manufacturers line (this assumes that the exact same setup was always used). But "percieved output" as used by Duncan and others (So to speak "how hot does it sound") is IMO actually a better value, because it takes into account the fact that a different tonality can make a pickup sound hotter or cooler than it really is.

And to be honest, isn´t the way it sounds much more important than an arbitrary value with near zero comparison value outside of the brand?

yes that is all that really matters to me is judging the output compared to others from the same brand. Obviously there is a specific way they all test their pickups, and it gives you an idea on how much hotter 1 pickup is than hte other.

Also at some point a pickup tops out where there is no more for it to give and thats probably the point where they test it. I'm sure they don't throw a set of 9-42 strings on a standard tuned strat and pick a note as hard as they can and see what the output is.

ANd the fact that seymour says a custom is "hot" and an invader is "hot" lol doesn't help at all since the invader and distortion seem like they are twice as hot (they are not obviously) than the custom! THe custom is riding the line of medium output and high output where invader is WAY up there. And with dimarzio you can see just how big of a difference there is.

 

[Zerberus]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

If testing to determine a pickup's output in mV is done correctly, it could actually be extremely meaningful. What most of you who shout it down are assuming is that it's being tested by a guy playing the guitar. If that were the case, then yeah, it'd be extremely inconsistent. However, if they have a controlled method of doing it, say, anything besides a person, it'd be pretty accurate.

Agreed 100%, but again I doubt that everyone would be willing to follow Dimarzio´s lead in this

Given all the measures people go to with clean boosts and whatnot, I'll never understand why people treat it as a secondary issue.

Output is never secondary. Just like engine displacement, output can only be substituted by more of itself :headbang:

But in the grand scheme of tone, output specs are secondary IMO :beerchug:

 

[Robert Delahunt]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

If output resistance isn't a good enough measurement, I apologize, but that's just how I think about it. Beyond that, since no guitar or amp is the same, it's all relative to me: I rank them based on other pickups, not in a somehow static (unchangeable) way. I just prefer a static measurement (resistance) versus one that's dynamic (i.e. "low/medium/high output", which is based on someone's ears). My 2 cents.

 

[WaR HeaD]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

thanks for the replies....

anyway, i understand that no one wants to add their output according to dimarzio, but, it is also true that every brand could make some tip of... from zero to ten, this pup output is 7.5 - with no need of comparison at all, just to know which pup has more or less output, if they don´t want to make some kind of business standards to compare betwen brands its fine...

about what stangme01 said, +1... seeking at the specs and finding 6 or 7 pups share his high output icon doesn´t really show me which one of these has more ouput than the other... some guy starting and finding for a pup could think all these high output pups has really the same output and changes only their voicing...

so out of this ones: Jb, Custom, Distortion, Invader, Dimebucker, custom custom, custom 5, screaming demon.... could you make some kind of output scale from the "less high output" to the "most high output" pup?

about the resistance=output thing i have search in the dimarzio website and find f.e. the tone zone with 17k having less output than the evolution with 14k if that helps...

 

[stangme01]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

as for the ones you have listed from low to high output;

screamin demon
Custom
Custom Custom
Custom 5
JB
Distortion
Dimebucker (i think its hotter than the distortion)
Invader

 

[stangme01]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

And the Dimarzio D activator bridge is only like 11K yet its output is one of hte highest output pups dimarzio has.

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

anyway, i understand that no one wants to add their output according to dimarzio, but, it is also true that every brand could make some tip of... from zero to ten, this pup output is 7.5 - with no need of comparison at all, just to know which pup has more or less output, if they don´t want to make some kind of business standards to compare betwen brands its fine...

That 1-10 scale would be a lot more useful than "moderate output" or "hot", wouldn't it?

so out of this ones: Jb, Custom, Distortion, Invader, Dimebucker, custom custom, custom 5, screaming demon.... could you make some kind of output scale from the "less high output" to the "most high output" pup?

Lowest to highest... Demon, CC, C5, Custom, JB/Dimebucker, Distortion, Invader.

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

If output resistance isn't a good enough measurement, I apologize, but that's just how I think about it. Beyond that, since no guitar or amp is the same, it's all relative to me: I rank them based on other pickups, not in a somehow static (unchangeable) way. I just prefer a static measurement (resistance) versus one that's dynamic (i.e. "low/medium/high output", which is based on someone's ears). My 2 cents.

You may as well rank their names. DC resistance is ONLY a good indicator of output if the pickups in question have the same pole pieces, magnets, baseplates, insulation type, wire guage, etc.... Change any of those (or other stuff I'm sure I forgot to mention) and the resistance is meaningless (as an output guage).

 

[daemon barbeque]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

Well i allways wanted the Companies to scale the output level.Maybe not in mV ,but more in a color spectrum ,or 1 to 20 or hundret.since the inavadretr and Distortion are in the same ballpark ,1 to 10 will not define it very well.And if invader would be 10 ,what is Live Wire HeavyMetal Bridge?.So it would be cool to make a wider spectrum.And ofcourse the "method" how the tests made have to be mentiooned too.Like A MIA Strat with 0.9/43 strings and so on.

BTW ,the resistence has nothing to do with the output indication.My PATB2 is with 21,3kohm really a burner ,but is as hot as Distortion with 6kohm less resitence.And the X2N is about the same league with Distortion ,and is allmost 1,5x louder.

 

[Robert Delahunt]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

Well i allways wanted the Companies to scale the output level.Maybe not in mV ,but more in a color spectrum ,or 1 to 20 or hundret.since the inavadretr and Distortion are in the same ballpark ,1 to 10 will not define it very well.And if invader would be 10 ,what is Live Wire HeavyMetal Bridge?.So it would be cool to make a wider spectrum.And ofcourse the "method" how the tests made have to be mentiooned too.Like A MIA Strat with 0.9/43 strings and so on.

BTW ,the resistence has nothing to do with the output indication.My PATB2 is with 21,3kohm really a burner ,but is as hot as Distortion with 6kohm less resitence.And the X2N is about the same league with Distortion ,and is allmost 1,5x louder.

But how shall we do this? Decibels? A loudness scale would mean someone hears it and decides it's a certain value. Decibels would be scientific, but would require a test rig and a lot of things to be the same which are difficult to control. Either way I don't care much. There may be an amp out there that loves high-mids (or a body wood, like maple), therefore that would tend to make the JB sound louder than it really is.

Oh well. Maybe just trusting what's on the SD website for low/medium/high output would work....

 

[JamesPaul]

Re: seymour duncan output specs

...

i have always wondered why does only dimarzio include the output on their pickups, while duncans doesn´t...

Quite similar to how I've always wondered why Dimarzio doesn't list resonant peak in their specifications. :wink:

Please don't interpret as a dig on Dimarzio.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled, productive SDUGF.