SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
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Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
Modified!
Sarcasm should be written in purple, or the statement could be used against you in a Forum, most probably taken out of context.
Modified!
LtKojak
New member
Artie
Peaveyologist
Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
BL definitely knew a thing or two about pickups, but he also knew a thing or two about marketing:
Nowhere does Seymour Duncan claim DCR to equal output. That's leap that we in the forum tend to take. He's giving a backhand slap to something the company never said. DCR is a valuable parameter if for no other reason that it helps to identify what pickup I might have or whether or not it's faulty. And DCR does give me hint as to a pickups' sonic character.
(Far more than shoes size indicates IQ.)
BL definitely knew a thing or two about pickups, but he also knew a thing or two about marketing:
Nowhere does Seymour Duncan claim DCR to equal output. That's leap that we in the forum tend to take. He's giving a backhand slap to something the company never said. DCR is a valuable parameter if for no other reason that it helps to identify what pickup I might have or whether or not it's faulty. And DCR does give me hint as to a pickups' sonic character.
(Far more than shoes size indicates IQ.)
darthphineas
New member
Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
Might not be in print, but there are those at SD that have spoken that way. And it's an incorrect suggestion that has been spread much further than this forum. Even so, there has not been a blog or an article or any form of information that I've seen or heard where SD has officially put this notion to rest. Meanwhile the DCR thing keeps popping up like the in-laws during the holidays, frequently from newbs that don't use the search function.
Sent from my armored space station via iPad using Tapatalk
Might not be in print, but there are those at SD that have spoken that way. And it's an incorrect suggestion that has been spread much further than this forum. Even so, there has not been a blog or an article or any form of information that I've seen or heard where SD has officially put this notion to rest. Meanwhile the DCR thing keeps popping up like the in-laws during the holidays, frequently from newbs that don't use the search function.
Sent from my armored space station via iPad using Tapatalk
Masta' C
Well-known member
Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
Wanna talk about DCR variance on production pickups? Check out the DiMarzio custom wound "Axis" pickups found in the EBMM guitars. Enthusiasts get so hung up on what these pickups "should" measure at, but I've been keeping a log for a while now. The necks have ranged from 14.6K to 16.1K, which is a 1.5K spread, and the bridges have ranged from 16.1K to 18.5K, which is a whopping 2.4K spread!
_B1_____N2_
16.1____14.6
16.3____15.8
16.8____15.0
16.9____15.3
17.1____14.6
17.5____15.4
17.7____14.6
17.7____16.1
18.5*___15.4*
18.0**_____
16.5_______
17.2_______
17.6_______
_______14.8
*B1 Coils @ 89°F:
green/white = 9.1
red/black = 9.4
*N2 Coils @ 89°F:
green/white = 7.6
red/black = 7.8
**B1 Coils @ 81°F:
green/white = 8.9
red/black = 9.1
And I completely concur...people get way too bent out of shape over DCR specs.
---
EDIT: Sorry, had an error in the list formatting. Updated.
Wanna talk about DCR variance on production pickups? Check out the DiMarzio custom wound "Axis" pickups found in the EBMM guitars. Enthusiasts get so hung up on what these pickups "should" measure at, but I've been keeping a log for a while now. The necks have ranged from 14.6K to 16.1K, which is a 1.5K spread, and the bridges have ranged from 16.1K to 18.5K, which is a whopping 2.4K spread!
_B1_____N2_
16.1____14.6
16.3____15.8
16.8____15.0
16.9____15.3
17.1____14.6
17.5____15.4
17.7____14.6
17.7____16.1
18.5*___15.4*
18.0**_____
16.5_______
17.2_______
17.6_______
_______14.8
*B1 Coils @ 89°F:
green/white = 9.1
red/black = 9.4
*N2 Coils @ 89°F:
green/white = 7.6
red/black = 7.8
**B1 Coils @ 81°F:
green/white = 8.9
red/black = 9.1
And I completely concur...people get way too bent out of shape over DCR specs.
---
EDIT: Sorry, had an error in the list formatting. Updated.
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Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
Did you not read what I said?...
"There is more to a pup than DC resistance. Just because two pups may read the same resistance does not mean that they are the same pup model. Otherwise all of these would be the same pup (with factoring in a 5% tolerance):"
Did you not read what I said?...
"There is more to a pup than DC resistance. Just because two pups may read the same resistance does not mean that they are the same pup model. Otherwise all of these would be the same pup (with factoring in a 5% tolerance):"
copperheadroads
New member
Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
I guess it's out of spec's .... Thanks for posting
I guess it's out of spec's .... Thanks for posting
Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
As for inconsistencies in DCR (resistance at DC voltage) of the wire for any pickups meant to be identical:
I'm pretty sure that they are winding these to spec via number of turns. I'm sure they get the most consistent wire they can, but SD doesn't make the winding wire they use.
The wire is usually designed to be a specific gauge, and very thin...which makes it very difficult to be perfectly consistent, even along the length of wire and weight of copper used to wind one pickup, let alone along the entirety of the spool sizes a company like SD must order.
So you're going to get variations in DCR. Company decides: do we wind, measure DCR, if low, continue winding, repeat until DCR spec....OR, do we wind each pickup to a certain number of turns with a specific wire (and with varying degrees of consistency in how they are wound on the bobbin from one to another) and then done? So it is.
As for the 16.4k rating but the 17.5k reading:
I will say, 17.5k turns to 16.4k when paralleled with 250k-your average volume pot. Not sure how SD vs other manufacturers measure their DCR...when I've measured pickups DCR "installed" and they're lower than rated spec, I typically chalk it up to the parallel resistance of the volume pot.
Anyhow, the amount of variables to be consistent with "simple" electronic components such as pickups and inductors and transformers - which are all based on coils of wire wrapped around...they're notoriously variable parts. When they're that consistent...well, you owe it to the manufacturer of the raw materials first and then everyone down the line from there for there to be any chance at consistency. No matter how hard you try, it's difficult. And DCR is really just one spec.
BTW, +/-5% is consistently written off as negligible and par for the course in engineering realms.
Anyone ever precision measure their guitar string's DCR resistance from set to set, weigh the strings for consistency from set to set, measure how precisely round (vs ovular) they are, and how exact their thickness is by the way?...I imagine EJ does...and No criticism intended, I just think each of us can only go so far with these things even with a lot of knowledge/understanding of the elements at play, though some can go further with it than others.
As for inconsistencies in DCR (resistance at DC voltage) of the wire for any pickups meant to be identical:
I'm pretty sure that they are winding these to spec via number of turns. I'm sure they get the most consistent wire they can, but SD doesn't make the winding wire they use.
The wire is usually designed to be a specific gauge, and very thin...which makes it very difficult to be perfectly consistent, even along the length of wire and weight of copper used to wind one pickup, let alone along the entirety of the spool sizes a company like SD must order.
So you're going to get variations in DCR. Company decides: do we wind, measure DCR, if low, continue winding, repeat until DCR spec....OR, do we wind each pickup to a certain number of turns with a specific wire (and with varying degrees of consistency in how they are wound on the bobbin from one to another) and then done? So it is.
As for the 16.4k rating but the 17.5k reading:
I will say, 17.5k turns to 16.4k when paralleled with 250k-your average volume pot. Not sure how SD vs other manufacturers measure their DCR...when I've measured pickups DCR "installed" and they're lower than rated spec, I typically chalk it up to the parallel resistance of the volume pot.
Anyhow, the amount of variables to be consistent with "simple" electronic components such as pickups and inductors and transformers - which are all based on coils of wire wrapped around...they're notoriously variable parts. When they're that consistent...well, you owe it to the manufacturer of the raw materials first and then everyone down the line from there for there to be any chance at consistency. No matter how hard you try, it's difficult. And DCR is really just one spec.
BTW, +/-5% is consistently written off as negligible and par for the course in engineering realms.
Anyone ever precision measure their guitar string's DCR resistance from set to set, weigh the strings for consistency from set to set, measure how precisely round (vs ovular) they are, and how exact their thickness is by the way?...I imagine EJ does...and No criticism intended, I just think each of us can only go so far with these things even with a lot of knowledge/understanding of the elements at play, though some can go further with it than others.
Last edited:
Mathías Gabriel Rock
New member
Re: SH-4 DCR measurement no where near what is listed.
So, how normal is an Alt 8 measuring 15.56K? Had me thinking all night.
So, how normal is an Alt 8 measuring 15.56K? Had me thinking all night.
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