So I was looking at the vault

cream123

JustAskinologist
and I found a link to a website that gave me a really cool idea. Here's the page. It really interests me. Now here's the thing: Is it possible for me with little to no elctronical knowledge to produce a good product? I'm thinking something like this. The look is amazing and I would really like to do this. The problem is, I don't think it has very many preamp stages but I'm not sure. I e-mailed the guy on tube types etc. I don't have the money now to start this but I'm just screwing around right now. I am seriously thinking about this. Is this a good idea? I'm don't know what I'm going to base it around yet as I don't know the tube types I'm going to use. Maybe all original??? If I do this, especially an original design, I'll be posting a lot more questions on this one. :D
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

Dude, I'm gunna be straight out with you.

1) Start with a few pedals from kits first. Trust me.
2) When you've fairly competent at low voltages (non lethal), get a relatively simple amp kit with garunteed tech support. Bruce at missionamps.com and his 5E3 kit is the best, hands down.
3) THEN maybe think about going all original or something.

Take it from me. I've built tons and tons of pedals, and even do so for a profit from time to time. I'm actually calling a guy right now to make PCBs for me so I can start selling the pedals I build at a lower cost. I jumped right in head first into a Marshall 1968 Plexi clone from metroamp.com. Dropped $1,300 on it. I am now looking at a fully completed amp that has a slight problem that I cant figure out how to troubleshoot. I have been 6 months without an amp except a cheap Epiphone "Acoustic Regent" Acoustic amp. I was told there would be tech support available, and there is for my kit. The problem is, George at metroamp doesnt have the time to do these himself, and I'd have to pay $40 and hour to have someone he designates do the amp. Luckily, Scott_F was kind enough to offer to take a look at it for me, but the agreement was he'll get to it when he finishes the amps he's got lined up to build for others... which may be abother 3 or 4 months for me, but he's doing it for free and I know exactly who I'm sending my amp to versus someone else who I may not get it back from again.

There's not many times I say this, partly because I always try to find some positive aspects of any bad decisions I make, but here goes: I F*CKED UP getting this kit instead of starting slow with the 5E3 from Bruce, which he garuntees to get working for you if you just cant seem to get it to work. I'm saying this because I dont want to see someone else make a huge mistake and get in over their head. No matter how much someone says they'll help you out, unfortunately you cant troubleshoot an amp if you dont got a meter in one hand (hopefully the other behind your back) and the amp in front of you.

I'm saying this to you cause you're a good kid, and I get that excited 8-year-old-on-christmas feeling when someone tells me they want to get into music electronics. This stuff gives me a freaking woody, it really does, that's why its best you stay in the shallow end of the pool until you really learn all the different strokes, cause I thought I was ready for the deep end and the water swallowed my ass up!

(Like the analogy?)

I recommend before you do anything, you build something like a rangemaster or a linear power booster. There are places that sell kits all over the net. www.buildyourownclone.com has great kits and their circuit boards are perfect to learn on because they are soldermasked. I wish they stil had their rangemaster clone kit cause it was the perfect "first kit" but they discontinued it for the tribooster which I dont particular care for. But find a kit you like there, all instructions are step-by-step and very straightforward.

My 200 cents.

jizoe.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

whatever, I don't care that much, not enough to go through 20 projects until I get to the point that I'm not interested anymore. I just wanted a fun project that I could screw around with that would actually profit me.
 
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Re: So I was looking at the vault

I know I can't fix it, but what exactly is the "small problem" with the plexi?
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

I know I can't fix it, but what exactly is the "small problem" with the plexi?

Is it just me or did you scale down your rig a bit? Or did you just remove some stuff from you sig?

Also looking at the 5e3 that's not really what I want...at all. I know I sound absurd here. Why would I take time to build something that I won't like?
 
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Re: So I was looking at the vault

Scott said they were sizing down sigs, and I couldn't keep my sig and take the "FOR SALE" stuff out. After getting tired of answering PMs about stuff when people really had no intentions of buying, I decided hell with it. My profile now houses all my gear.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

Scott said they were sizing down sigs, and I couldn't keep my sig and take the "FOR SALE" stuff out. After getting tired of answering PMs about stuff when people really had no intentions of buying, I decided hell with it. My profile now houses all my gear.

I got ya.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

Hey Joe,

I'll second the question, what seems to be the problem with the amp? I might be able to lend you a hand, but it is hard to diagnose across the 'net.

Roger
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

Also looking at the 5e3 that's not really what I want...at all. I know I sound absurd here. Why would I take time to build something that I won't like?

That's exactly what I said. But if you're seriously interested in learning to build amps, having a guy who says "I gauruntee to get it working for you" is a lot different than "join the forums and post your problems there." an amp is definately not a walk in the park and the voltages are lethal. I got 490 volts at after the rectifier on my amp... you cant slip at all there.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

Hey Joe,

I'll second the question, what seems to be the problem with the amp? I might be able to lend you a hand, but it is hard to diagnose across the 'net.

Roger

Bah, its making a popping sound in the speakers with all controls set to zero. Thought it was arcing somewhere so I resoldered all of the board connections and resoldered the board in place, and the voltages in the PI started varying.

Its also giving me weird issues, like for instance, I'll fire it up and one voltage will be off. I'll reheat a few solder joints in those areas, and then wait 10 minutes, fire it up, and the voltages have changed in other places... its all on the PI tube, everything else is fine. I've tried swapping the tubes around in different positions and its still there, so I know its not the tube. I'm just over my head really. :smack:
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

Anyone else?
Yeah. I'll give you the opposing point of view. DIY guitar amps are a blast. You're not to young to learn. You have to take it slow, and do your research. Kits are good, but not necessary. Start with something simple, with plenty of support. If a Fender-style amp doesn't float your boat, there are more Marshally-type amps out there - the AX84 P1 and P1-EX come to mind. My first build was an 18 Watter, the Lite II variant is about the simplest push-pull amp out there and it rocks. (Follow the link in my signature to "The Workshop".)

Donor amps are a great way to get started - they save you the grunt work of punching and drilling chassis, mounting sockets and transformers, etc. Frees you up to concentrate on the circuitry.

That amp you found is absolutely the coolest I've seen. It looks like something out of Radar's shack on M*A*S*H. It would probably have to be completely gutted to build a guitar amp out of it, but you'd be left with some good transformers, and the tube sockets ready for a mid-sized amp. Right now it has a pair of 6L6's and a tube rectifier, so it's good for 35 watts or a bit more. It would make a great Tweed amp, or a slightly undersized JTM45, or a 6V6 Plexi. Looks like somebody already modded it a bit - I don't think those small (12AX7?) tubes in the foreground are original. His starting bid is a bit high, but I wouldn't be surprised if it sells. I might bid myself if you don't.

If you want to pursue the DIY amp hobby, PM me.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

Yeah. I'll give you the opposing point of view. DIY guitar amps are a blast. You're not to young to learn. You have to take it slow, and do your research. Kits are good, but not necessary. Start with something simple, with plenty of support. If a Fender-style amp doesn't float your boat, there are more Marshally-type amps out there - the AX84 P1 and P1-EX come to mind.

I 2nd the vote for an Ax84 P1-Ex. Simple to build (although it took me forever, because I was so anal about triple-checking every step I took), and sounds great. There's also lots of tuning to be had. For example, I have a switch that partially switches between the original an alternative tonestack. The original is Fendery, and the alternative is Marshally (the switch changes the slope resistor and treble caps). There is also the cascode boost mod, which adds an insane amount of gain.

Overall, a great first project with lots of support. Even better, is that it has a very usable set of tones.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

I am going to go half way on the opinions. If you dont have soldering skills, you dont need to start with a tube amp kit thats going to cost you $350
You need to start with something smaller, less expensive. Best bet is to go through the steps as suggested, but I dont think it is strictly neccesary. But, really dont need to do your first soldering and building on a fairly expensive tube amp.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

really what I'm thinking is something with ampeg type tubes i.e. 7591/7868. I really like those tubes. I don't know what type of caps to use, I was thinking maybe in a general Marshall type setup only with 7591 tubes. Would this be good?
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

really what I'm thinking is something with ampeg type tubes i.e. 7591/7868. I really like those tubes. I don't know what type of caps to use, I was thinking maybe in a general Marshall type setup only with 7591 tubes. Would this be good?

There's soooooooo much more to picking out what type of caps and what you want the amp to sound like. If you have no electrical experience and you're expecting to design an amp right out, you're in over you're head. Building an amp is a very rigorous and, at times, daunting task that requires hours upon hours of work. If you don't have the determination to build some pedals first to hone your skills, then you probably wont have the determination to build an amplifier. Just my 2 cents.
 
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Re: So I was looking at the vault

Cream, I agree with Joelap...start slow with a pedal or two.

It does not matter what we guys want to accomplish, the extra gear/tools needed to accomplish a goal is a necessary evil that must still be accounted for. What I am saying is, I know I would need to spend nearly $120 for a solder iron, and solder supplies (solder/flux/braid/chemicals)...as well as getting a simple digital multimeter for $10 (if you want to get killed :smack:) to $40 or more, to build the simplest amp (transistor or tube). There are many other incidentals such as glues/paints/coverings/drills/drill bits/saws/saw blades...the list is infinite!

Putting a few hours in on a basic "clone" pedal build is fun! Get an inexpensive 20-30 Watt iron, some solder...and just get your feet wet merely assembling a small device...and acqainting yourself with basic soldering techniques.

The first pedal I ever built was a fuzz-box in the eighth grade. I'm still learning about soldering/desoldering styles/techniques/tools.

I wish you the best. :)
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

I'll just leave it up so other beginners don't make the mistake I was going to make. I said I might want to make an original. Heck, I'm thinking about just basing off an old Ampeg right now but that would just be too hard.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

If you don't have the determination to build some pedals first to hone your skills, then you probably wont have the determination to build an amplifier. Just my 2 cents.

There's soooooooo much more to what my views are on this than you know apperently. I have the determination to build an amp. In my mind at least, who knows I'm known to be wrong a lot. I just don't want all these useless, simple pedals lying around. I realize somtimes simple is good but I don't need a boost! I don't want to spend any wasted time and money on something that I don't need.

Who knows maybe I'm coming off as a stupid, inexperienced, arrogant kid but maybe that's what I am. Who knows? I just wanted to have some fun. Not spend $100 on something horribley wrong for me. If you can think of something that actually is usefull I'll think about it. The AX84 intruiges me but again, not quite what I want.
 
Re: So I was looking at the vault

I wouldn't personally discourage anyone from doing anything per say. You've got to learn somehow right. But I will offer some advice. As you probably already know. Amps can kill you if you're not carefull.

My advice would be find a good tech in your area and talk to him about helping you out on your endeavor. Reading all the crap in the world on internet is a great start and you really can learn alot, but since this could possibly fry your eyesockets, It would be worth your while to have some that already has some hands on experience in your corner from the start.
 
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