Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

[Luke Duke]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

I think one of the reasons that people don't talk about them as much is because guitar players, and audio buffs all KNOW speakers make a difference so they just don't mention it. In reality that should probably be one of the first questions asked.

Some of the largest rig tuning moves I've made have been with speakers. For example when I felt like the high end was too brittle and the low end to boomy in my 4x12 I had the G1280s reconed as big magnet 65s...2 with 75 and two with 55 hz cones. This gave me a LOT more mid texture and increased the low mids significantly. The last speaker swapping I did was to pull a Eminence Wizard and to install a Private Jack. HUGE HUGE difference. It fixed all the sonic qualities I didn't love in the new amp I had traded for. The scooped harder edged tone was replaced by and more even softer sound that sounded FANTASTIC on leads. In fact I gigged with that rig for the first time the other night and got all kinds of compliments on my tone.

 

[Kramer Guy]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Speakers make a huge difference . I have installed Eminence Rajun Cajuns in my Fender Frontman 25R and Champion 30 combos and just a few days ago , bought a Eminence Texas Heat which went in my 1988 Fender Studio 85 combo. These speakers have given my amps new life as far as both sound and extra volume are concerned .

 

[GuitarStv]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Very, very large difference. I'd say more than changing the tubes, and maybe more than pickups being used.

My amp with a v30 in it doesn't sound or behave the same way as it does with a C. Rex.

 

[hydro]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

i'd take g12H100's any day over v30s, but everything is personal preference and the context of the sounds being used must come into consideration.

The cab in question with the G12H100s was originally paired with a Marshall Superbass MKII. It is a pretty awesome cab but my bass player wants it, and I have heard really good things about the dual recto 4x12 cabs. Hoping it will sound a little more focused and responsive although I really don't have complaints about the Marshall. I always wondered if the speakers in the Marshall bass cabs were somehow different from other 12" celestions rated the same way, or if they were the same speakers.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

I always wondered if the speakers in the Marshall bass cabs were somehow different from other 12" celestions rated the same way, or if they were the same speakers.

Depends on the speaker. Sometimes they are the same speakers sometimes not. Theres multiple versions of the V30 floating around. Right now if you want a original spec V30 you have to get it from Mesa not Marshall. Alot of times a manufacturer would request a same rated speaker from celestion at a cheaper price point so they would wind up with a different version. The short answer is know what you are buying.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Just a brief aside...

What would the tight bass, pushed miss/highs, but without being too harsh speaker be?

Like "What is the Duncan Distortion" of speakers???? Say for a 100watt 1x12 open back Marshall Combo?

 

[Agileguy_101]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

What would the tight bass, pushed miss/highs, but without being too harsh speaker be?

Sounds like a Cannabis Rex, except the C. Rex is only rated for 50W. Look into the Swamp Thang.

 

[TwilightOdyssey]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Swamp Thang.

 

[beaubrummels]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

I'm well aware speakers make a huge difference, but in general I naturally tend to think of speakers last just because logically they are last in the signal path. The pickups and body are right under my fingers while I play, so they tend to come to mind first.

 

[Ascension]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Just a brief aside...

What would the tight bass, pushed miss/highs, but without being too harsh speaker be?

Like "What is the Duncan Distortion" of speakers???? Say for a 100watt 1x12 open back Marshall Combo?

I like the WGS retro 30 for that tone in an open back or if you want a darker smoother tone the Vet 30. Only thing is it's a 70 watt speaker so if you are REALLY cranking the 100 watter you might smoke it.
I have a WGS Retro 30 in the Zinky velvet now and am REALLY digging the tones!

 

[Van Noord]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Speakers are your rig's ability to verbalize. Your rig's vocabulary ability if you will.

Your amp (brain) may in fact have some righteous tones (ideas), but if you are unable to communicate them effectively with use of your choice of speakers (words) than those tones (ideas) can be lost or severely hindered.

 

[Powdered Toast Man]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Changing speakers is to an amp what changing pickups is to a guitar. I had no idea how much change since I finally decided to take a chance and buy a different speaker for my 5E3 build than what came with the kit. It was such a stupendous change that I've now changed speakers in every amp I own. Webers are awesome for Fender amps.

 

[TwilightOdyssey]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Webers are awesome for Fender amps.

Yes! This!

Strat + Fender circuit amp + Weber Alnico = tasty tones!

 

[James Rock]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

I've had mixed experiences in the difference. When I got my cab I first used it with a Pro Junior and wow so much bigger, cleaner, deeper, and better sounding albeit alot louder (too loud for some gigs). From that experience I thought speakers made so much difference, this and when using Amp Sims different cab emulations (even of the same speakers) sound so different. That said I used my amps line out through an acoustic amps power amp with a 15" speaker and horn and it still sounding very much like my amp and way way better then using my Zoom, very different construction to my 2x12 open back cab although my cab still probably sounds a fair bit better in an A/B. Also the audio engineer in me definitely knows speakers make difference for sound in general. I think something else understated is Cab construction, even with the same speakers different cabs can sound drastically different (easiest comparison of this is comparing MESA, Marshall and Orange Cabs with V30s).

 

[Soulcrusher_X]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Speakers are the Ying to the Amps Yang. Not that you wont have a good sound with less than the ideal pairing, but that extra 10% - 20% with the right speaks in the right cabinet can be the difference between"just" a good sound and a great tone. For instance, people using greenbacks with JCM 800's. I dont think thats an actual combination that was ever used by Father Marshall, and also the pairing of G12H-30/greenback is absiolutely wrong, and the G12h mutes the Greenback, casues all kinds of bad crosstalk, and it sounds bad and it diminsishes the strengths of the Marshall JCM .
The amp was made for G12H-30's, and G12-65's, even G12-t 75's( try a cross of G12T-75's and V30's , is pretty good also), but i cringe when I hear a greenback , or a Greenback G12-h combo. Now, the g12h/V30 is good, it works real well.
Ideally, you want the G12h-30's, or the G12-65's for the JCM. That was Father Marshalls wisdom of the ages, and I'm not about to go against that.See?

What's wrong with a JCM800 into Greenbacks? Worked for Megadeth for 25 years or so. I'm sure there are countless other bands/guitarists who use this combo. IMO, Marshall + Greenback = rock n f@ckin roll, man. Personally, it's one of my favorite combos. See? Iommi, in the 80s used a modded Marshall and G12H30-55hz. Also good. Robin Trower, Marshall and G12-65, also good. Iron Maiden, Marshall and G12T-75. Slayer, Marshall and V30/G12K-100. All sorts of great combos.

You cringe....I'll rock.

 

[Soulcrusher_X]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

In a serious note, I find that speakers are 50%+ of the overall tone. It is the physical connection of your guitar-pickup-amp to the world. As many different guitars, pickups, amps as you try through ONE cab, the core tone will remain. I see most of the other parts as fine-tuning to the tone, but MORE as how everything interacts with playability.

It also depends heavily on WHAT speaker is in the cab. Some speakers are more neutral, and some have a very heavy tonal footprint.

 

[zzmoore]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Guitar players seem to have drawers and closets full of:
pedals
picks
cables
guitars
amps
tubes
But nobody ever seems to own any speakers. Every player should have a few cabs and at least 3 different types of speakers.
best

 

[Van Noord]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Guitar players seem to have drawers and closets full of:
pedals
picks
cables
guitars
amps
tubes
But nobody ever seems to own any speakers. Every player should have a few cabs and at least 3 different types of speakers.
best

Yup, I've got Mesa V30's, Chinese V30's, Veteran 30's, Retro 30's, Mesa MC90's and Eminence Legends all at my disposal. I find it's necessary when you own a lot of amps.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Yes! This!

Strat + Fender circuit amp + Weber Alnico = tasty tones!

I actually have a Weber Blueback in My Pro Jr.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Speakers; How under-estimated are they in an amps sound?

Guitar players seem to have drawers and closets full of:
pedals
picks
cables
guitars
amps
tubes
But nobody ever seems to own any speakers. Every player should have a few cabs and at least 3 different types of speakers.
best

+1.