Staggered tuners...
- Thread starter GregJr
- Start date
Re: Staggered tuners...
What?
You've GOT to be kidding me!
(And no other manufacturer has mass-produced nuts? And Gibsons are better?!)
What?
You've GOT to be kidding me!
(And no other manufacturer has mass-produced nuts? And Gibsons are better?!)
Re: Staggered tuners...
The main feature of the staggered-height tuners is that they make the strings come off of the nut at approximately the same angle, it has nothing to do with a badly-cut nut or anything else. This is very important on Strat-type guitars, many Strat players do something similar by putting different amounts of winds on the tuner shafts to make the string angles similar. It is one trick to help keep a vintage Fender tremelo unit in tune.
Al
The main feature of the staggered-height tuners is that they make the strings come off of the nut at approximately the same angle, it has nothing to do with a badly-cut nut or anything else. This is very important on Strat-type guitars, many Strat players do something similar by putting different amounts of winds on the tuner shafts to make the string angles similar. It is one trick to help keep a vintage Fender tremelo unit in tune.
Al
jumble jumble
New member
Re: Staggered tuners...
Gibson have angled headstocks instead. No I'm not kidding you, if you have a badly-cut nut, a string retainer can often fix it. Note that this doesn't mean all Fender nuts are badly cut. It means that occasionally some are, and so they put the retainer(s) on as standard so that it won't matter.
Re: Staggered tuners...
Could you please explain how a string tree corrects a badly cut nut. If this were the case you'd see a lot of guitars with string trees. It's way easier and cheaper to install a tree than to cut a nut accurately.
And, by "badly cut" what the heck do you mean?
(I've had badly cut nuts, but only replacing them could correct what was "bad" about them. Some just needed the slots relieved or deepened.)
Could you please explain how a string tree corrects a badly cut nut. If this were the case you'd see a lot of guitars with string trees. It's way easier and cheaper to install a tree than to cut a nut accurately.
And, by "badly cut" what the heck do you mean?
(I've had badly cut nuts, but only replacing them could correct what was "bad" about them. Some just needed the slots relieved or deepened.)
constant mesh
New member
Re: Staggered tuners...
That's completely bogus. Please define a wrongly cut nut, first. If the fallaway in the slot is not steep enough it only increases friction in the slot. A string tree in this cause would only worsen the problem because the friction in the slot would increase significantly too. Steep fallaway so that the string lands only on the front of the slot towards the bridge is somewhat ideal as friction here is minimal which is crucial for best tremolo performance. Square cut or V-slots are even superior to more traditional U-shape ones.
The reason for staggered tuners and string trees is that the farther your go from the nut to the appropriate tuner, the angle gets smaller, almost parallel to the body. This can be solved with more turns on the peg to get the string to sit lower but that puts havoc on the trem. They are designed to hold the strings as low as possible even with fewer winds than optimal.
The tuning pegs for the B and hi-E are too far out to keep a good angle on the nut. Sure Fenders work without a string tree with a perfectly tuned nut for the B and E, but 90% of the time the two strings will buzz behind the nut because of that (with an LSR chances are all six strings will buzz open naturally - and most Strats without trees use the LSR). When the string does not go past the nut at an sufficient angle, it will sympathetically vibrate. The string has to be 'broken' off solidly at the saddle and the nut in order to call it a guitar.
That's completely bogus. Please define a wrongly cut nut, first. If the fallaway in the slot is not steep enough it only increases friction in the slot. A string tree in this cause would only worsen the problem because the friction in the slot would increase significantly too. Steep fallaway so that the string lands only on the front of the slot towards the bridge is somewhat ideal as friction here is minimal which is crucial for best tremolo performance. Square cut or V-slots are even superior to more traditional U-shape ones.
The reason for staggered tuners and string trees is that the farther your go from the nut to the appropriate tuner, the angle gets smaller, almost parallel to the body. This can be solved with more turns on the peg to get the string to sit lower but that puts havoc on the trem. They are designed to hold the strings as low as possible even with fewer winds than optimal.
The tuning pegs for the B and hi-E are too far out to keep a good angle on the nut. Sure Fenders work without a string tree with a perfectly tuned nut for the B and E, but 90% of the time the two strings will buzz behind the nut because of that (with an LSR chances are all six strings will buzz open naturally - and most Strats without trees use the LSR). When the string does not go past the nut at an sufficient angle, it will sympathetically vibrate. The string has to be 'broken' off solidly at the saddle and the nut in order to call it a guitar.
jumble jumble
New member
Re: Staggered tuners...
So with a perfect nut you don't need the trees to avoid buzz, and for the other 90% the trees will solve buzz. Happy to agree on that.
So with a perfect nut you don't need the trees to avoid buzz, and for the other 90% the trees will solve buzz. Happy to agree on that.
FretFire
SingedFingerologist
Re: Staggered tuners...
This. There's a lot of crazy misinformation in this thread, but this is correct.
This. There's a lot of crazy misinformation in this thread, but this is correct.
jumble jumble
New member
Re: Staggered tuners...
Yeah and I'm not going to. You've won.
Yeah and I'm not going to. You've won.
