The Fishman KSE's are in! My thoughts...

Rex_Rocker

Well-known member
I posted a thread recently asking about these pickups... but I just got them in! I actually had to take my guitar in to have them professionally installed because I utterly failed at installing them with all the push pulls and four knob configuration of my Les Paul... so yeah, LOL.

But I just got them in, and I really like them! This is my fourth different Fishman set I've tried, and I gotta say, I'm more and more impressed with these pickups the more I try them.

The bridge pickup in Voice 1 is sorta like a Modern's Voice 1 (kinda like a tighter, clearer EMG 81), except even tighter! It doesn't have a lot of low-end, really, but I find that is really usable when tuning to Drop C with 12's on a fat-sounding Les Paul. It really balances out, and it makes the guitar sound TIGHT! This is by far the tightest-sounding pickup I've tried. I know it will not be for everyone, especially people who find the 81 too thin, but this pickup makes the 81 sound like a bloated mess. It's almost the exact opposite direction Duncan Blackouts take. It also has a really nice bump in the upper mids that really brings out the pick attack and aggression. I dig it! My only gripe... well, not really gripe, but the thing that caught me off guard is that it's actually not super high output. The 500T it replaced was MUCH hotter. Even the Quarter Pound in my Esquire is a little bit hotter, LOL. But that's an easy fix. Just gotta raise the gain, and this pickup takes gain like a champ.

Voice 2 on the bridge pickup is good. It's not my favorite, TBH. It's kinda fat and smooth. I know this is supposed to be going after a PRS pickup KSE have, and... well, it's alright, I suppose. It's not the star of the show, for me. But it's nice to have in there. I actually find it kinda cool that there is more difference between V1 and 2 in the KSE bridge pickup that there is in the Modern's V1 and 2. I think that's a nice change. It's medium output for sure. Not super hot.

The neck pickup in Voice 1... FINALLY! A neck pickup that I actually like! I suppose this is based off the Modern Alnico V1, which is sorta like a more balanced EMG 85. It's pretty smooth without being dark or overly fat. It's also hot, so it doesn't have any trouble keeping up with the bridge pickup (which, like I said, is not that hot). Cleans sound cool, but leads... that's where it's at for me! Really smoooooooooth and creamy without being overly fat. I've always really liked how active neck pickups take gain.

Voice 2 on the neck... cool! Like a balanced, not overly weak passive. Has a really cool clean tone that's not overly scooped or chirpy like some low-wind passives can be, or that it's too stiff and lifeless like some hotter passives are. I didn't really spend much time on it, but I definetly see it's potential.

Voice 3 on both pickups... single coil goodness. I really like single coil modes on all the Fishmans I've had. Not just a standard coil split, but rather, a pickup that's actually voiced like a single coil. It's very nice. It's chimey on the neck, and punchy in the bridge. My Les Paul actually pulls off the Tele sound better than my Esquire which now has a Quarter Pound, LOL.

So all in all... really dig them! I love all Fishman sets I've tried so far. Really recommend them!
 
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3 sounds in one guitar sounds tempting.
the moderate output sounds interesting too. (My Amp sound best if the gain is higher than 9:00. Below that it get's kind of LowFi. and EMGs on 9:00 is already gainy enough)
But i currently have no need for a pickup that tight.
If i build a 7 string explorer i will try some fishmans in there, but i guess the moderns will be tight enough for my needs.
Wouldn't a simple highpass (series cap) do the same?

the EMPTY Blackouts are actually not bloated like the standards, but also not as steril as EMGs soemtimes can be.

You still have all fluence sets running?
 
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3 sounds in one guitar sounds tempting.
the moderate output sounds interesting too. (My Amp sound best if the gain is higher than 9:00. Below that it get's kind of LowFi. and EMGs on 9:00 is already gainy enough)
But i currently have no need for a pickup that tight.
If i build a 7 string explorer i will try some fishmans in there, but i guess the moderns will be tight enough for my needs.
Wouldn't a simple highpass (series cap) do the same?

the EMPTY Blackouts are actually not bloated like the standards, but also not as steril as EMGs soemtimes can be.

You still have all fluence sets running?
Yeah, I think Moderns are more than tight enough. I just wanted to try the KSE's, and FWIW, I really like them. I don't have the Moderns anymore to comment on how they compare directly, but I'm pretty sure the Moderns were slightly hotter. Not BLISTERINGLY hot, thow. About the same level as the EMG 81/85, which is hot, but not Black Winter/X2N hot. Funny you mention the EMTYs, because I'm pretty sure those are way hotter. I haven't tried those, but I've tried the standard Blackouts and those are ridiculously hot.

No, I don't have any of the other Fishman sets anymore. Well, matter of fact, I still have the Adlers, but I just don't have another guitar to put them in, LOL. The Adlers are SUPER nice. The bridge pickup is supposedly based off the Duncan Distortion in V1 and the Modern's V1 in V2. Fantastic bridge pickup. The neck pickup is nice... just wish it was a tad less PAF-y sounding.

I've had the Classics (both old no single coil voicing and current open cores with single coil voice) and Moderns. The Moderns are just the epitome of tight modern pickups. The Classics are cool if you're looking for either a PAF tone in V1 or a slightly more balanced JB in V2. I never liked how V1 or 2 in the neck pickup matched the JB voicing of the Classics, though. V2 is just not that great in the neck Classic. V1 is cool, but a bit plinky and underpowered with V2 in the bridge, which was my favorite. Not to diss on the Classics, though, because I'm all about V2 on the bridge pickup!
 
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Good to see these descriptions. Makes me even more interested in the Classics if I ever wind up going back to active pickups on anything.
 
I take that back. I've been messing with Voice 2 on the bridge pickup, and it's totally usable. Almost won me over, but the attack on Voice 1 is to-die-for.

Voice 2 has more of a passive EQ (duh) where there's more top-end and low-end. I think the problem was I was initially comparing it to the last passive I had in the guitar (the 500T), but it's nothing like that. It's way less hot. Like... waaaaaay less. It's also more refined, less over-the-top, and more polite. The "passive" modes on Fishmans have always been kinda like that to me. Yes, they're definitely passive-like in terms of EQ and dynamics, but they've always got a hint of... refinement, for a lack of a better word.

Now, passive lovers, don't take that the wrong way. They really nail the whole dynamics and feel part. Especially the Classics.

But yeah, Voice 2 is definitely not dark, as I initially thought. It's pretty balanced, for a ceramic "passive". Doesn't seem to be as high-mid pushed or ratty as a Duncan Distortion (I love the Duncan Distortion, BTW) or as scooped and boomy as a Custom. It's a totally usable sound, just not very Duncan-like.
 
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Yeah, I think Moderns are more than tight enough. I just wanted to try the KSE's, and FWIW, I really like them. I don't have the Moderns anymore to comment on how they compare directly, but I'm pretty sure the Moderns were slightly hotter. Not BLISTERINGLY hot, thow. About the same level as the EMG 81/85, which is hot, but not Black Winter/X2N hot. Funny you mention the EMTYs, because I'm pretty sure those are way hotter. I haven't tried those, but I've tried the standard Blackouts and those are ridiculously hot.
is this with or without the 6 db ??? boost/attenuation?
The Blackouts standards where ridiculously hot, yes. At first it was fun, but it was way too bloated and out of control.
Also the Blackouts metal are off limits with or without the jumper.
I don't know if the EMTYs are the same output. Hotter than EMGs for sure. But they are much more manageable, but yes i would prefer less output.
No, I don't have any of the other Fishman sets anymore. Well, matter of fact, I still have the Adlers, but I just don't have another guitar to put them in, LOL. The Adlers are SUPER nice. The bridge pickup is supposedly based off the Duncan Distortion in V1 and the Modern's V1 in V2. Fantastic bridge pickup. The neck pickup is nice... just wish it was a tad less PAF-y sounding.

I've had the Classics (both old no single coil voicing and current open cores with single coil voice) and Moderns. The Moderns are just the epitome of tight modern pickups. The Classics are cool if you're looking for either a PAF tone in V1 or a slightly more balanced JB in V2. I never liked how V1 or 2 in the neck pickup matched the JB voicing of the Classics, though. V2 is just not that great in the neck Classic. V1 is cool, but a bit plinky and underpowered with V2 in the bridge, which was my favorite. Not to diss on the Classics, though, because I'm all about V2 on the bridge pickup!
guess i will try some someday, but way down on my ToDo list.
 
is this with or without the 6 db ??? boost/attenuation?
The Blackouts standards where ridiculously hot, yes. At first it was fun, but it was way too bloated and out of control.
Also the Blackouts metal are off limits with or without the jumper.
I don't know if the EMTYs are the same output. Hotter than EMGs for sure. But they are much more manageable, but yes i would prefer less output.
TBH, I never even tried the 6dB attenuation. I didn't feel the need to. Plus I suck at soldering, LOL. I could barely manage to do the single push pull pot install to change the voicing.

I've read accounts on the Fishman Moderns being over the top hot, but that was not my experience. I actually replaced EMG's in an old LTD EX-401 with the Moderns, and didn'f find any difference in output whatsoever. I track DI's all the time, and I think that is the truest representation of output where you can actually see how far up the peaks in a pickup go compared to others. Pretty close to the same. So I'm willing to bet the 6dB attenuation might bring them closer to what you want as far as output goes.

They also have a high frequency tilt thing that attenuates the highs. I didn't feel like they needed it, though. They're VERY clear and revealing, but they're not over the top bright. I think the reason why they might stick out as brighter than EMG's to someone is because they're tighter (meaning slightly less low-end) and more clarity... but I don't actually think there's much more high-end whatsoever. I've never found the 81 to be overly bright, personally, and I think the Modern Ceramic isn't far off.

The KSE's are brighter in Voice 1 compared to Moderns, but they're more attacky/bitey/focused rather than sizzly or airy like a passive.

They do have several revisions, though. And I remember reading the earlier revisions were brighter and hotter. Mine were Rev 3.5, which I think is the latest, and they were neither too bright nor hot.

Also, I haven't tried this with Fishmans, but with EMG's, just having a tone knob in the circuit (even if it's rolled all the way up) attenuates the signal by 3dB. I've measured it. I guess it has to do with loading the pickup's preamp. So if you don't have a tone knob in your guitar, you might want to consider one to slightly attenuate the signal.
 
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if you can hear a difference at that distortion levels, the different revision must be very different or the comparison wasn't done right...

Anyway. if i could dump round about EMG levels by 6 db that would be the perfect range for my 3rd channel.
Thanks for the input :Thumps Up:

yes if you don't solder the tone it's a bit more output with the old EMGs.
 
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