The Truth About Tube Screamers

[Skarekrough]

So, in the past few years I've become slightly obsessed with Tube Screamers and the minor (but sometimes major) variations on them. They're legendary pedals but I tend to find alot of information about them is typically a little off, and often embellished or fudged for the sake of making a sale.

I'd like this thread to really cover the truths about them; what the real vintage Tube Screamers are, what the variations on the market consist of and their differences to the original, and also the slew of mods that can be done to them. Are the vintage ones really worth the dough? Are the reissues true to the originals, and if not what is it that makes them different? Is one of the "lesser" Tube Screamers an acceptable pedal out of the box or does it really require modding?

We've got some great experts on tap here at the SD forum, as well as alot of folks who know a little. I'm hoping we can put all of the information we have together and get some real positive references out of it.

 

[RockStarNick]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

This would be a GREAT thread, but as of now, its very very broad.

Should we narrow it to reviews or TS like pedals? Comparing them to the originals?

For example, perhaps start out by stating the known facts about the original Tube screamer (TS808), then the TS9, and from there, we can compare and contrast other overdrive pedals?

 

[Skarekrough]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

This would be a GREAT thread, but as of now, its very very broad.

Should we narrow it to reviews or TS like pedals? Comparing them to the originals?

For example, perhaps start out by stating the known facts about the original Tube screamer (TS808), then the TS9, and from there, we can compare and contrast other overdrive pedals?

I'm kind of hoping for it to be broad so that we've got a good amount of information to pull from and enough people looking at it to keep it comprehensive.

Someone putting together a list of the specs of TS's would be good. I don't know enough about all of them to do it myself. But having something that would tell us the model number, when it was offered, what chip it has, country of manufacture and where the chip was made (another thing I'm wondering about) would be a phenomenal start.

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

So, in the past few years I've become slightly obsessed with Tube Screamers and the minor (but sometimes major) variations on them. They're legendary pedals but I tend to find alot of information about them is typically a little off, and often embellished or fudged for the sake of making a sale.

I'd like this thread to really cover the truths about them; what the real vintage Tube Screamers are, what the variations on the market consist of and their differences to the original, and also the slew of mods that can be done to them. Are the vintage ones really worth the dough? Are the reissues true to the originals, and if not what is it that makes them different? Is one of the "lesser" Tube Screamers an acceptable pedal out of the box or does it really require modding?

We've got some great experts on tap here at the SD forum, as well as alot of folks who know a little. I'm hoping we can put all of the information we have together and get some real positive references out of it.

The series is pretty good right out of the box but I always found I wanted more gain,more lows,and less mid spike,but the pedal does have a nice smooth,singing tone with some compression....I'm not going to give out my own specific mod secrets here on the forum,but everyone that mods them does all or some of the following mods....Raise cap values for more lows and mids,diode changes(isymetrical or symetrical clipping)opamp changes,resistance changes for more or less gain or eq tweaks,808 output resistor changes...Alot of people don't realize that component tolerences between pots and other working components within the circuit make a difference from pedal to pedal after you change the chip and the 2 808 resistors..Just adding much better caps and replacing the electrolytics in a TS is an improvement in the tone also...

The biggest problem with vintage TS9 and 808 pedals is alot of "hype" over they years and SRV used it...:smack:

 

[ErikH]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

The biggest problem with vintage TS9 and 808 pedals is alot of "hype" over they years and SRV used it...:smack:

Exactly. Circuitwise, there is absolutely no difference between the reissues and the vintage and even the cheaper models. Heck, get a cheap soundtank, change out a few parts and you have a killer sounding tube screamer.

I could go on and on about them. There's literally hundreds of variations out there, some from boutique builders, some DIY (like myself), some from other manufacturers. Here's a piece of truth...the Boss SD-1 and Ibanez Tube Screamer are practically identical. The biggest difference being the diode clipping (assymetrical vs. symetrical).

There is a great article out there that I have read countless times. It was written by one of the smartest electronics guys I've ever met. It's called "The Technology of the Tube Screamer". There is also this one from Analog Man, Ibanez Tube Screamer History. As far as mods, there's loads of 'em like John said. You can check out Aron's Stompbox Forum for some mods.

I'll stop here so this stuff can be absorbed.

 

[Dave Z]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

Aron's is the place folks. Built my own version of the TS - the Alexa - and got all I wanted from it, it's pretty cool, got a Fulldive-type "Comp cut" switch, I can do asym clipping or symmetrical, and full range input cap - makes it big & bad. If I want treble boost (essentially what the input cap does) I kick in the Tristan, a FET booster with a switchable cap on a 5-pos rotary.

My SD1 sounds like playing through a vacuum hose in comparison to the Alexa (yes, the SD1 sucks ;-).

Dead easy to build with a PCB, see the Son of Screamer by Jack Orman, which I used as the foundation for the Alexa.

About the same:
SD1
TS808
TS9 and variants

Minus the in & output buffering:
Son of Screamer
Barber Direct Drive
The Alexa!

For the $$ you would spend on boutiquers you can buy the a soldering gun and parts including a PCB and make 5 of these!

 

[Scott_F]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

I never found one that I liked enough to keep it more than a few months....

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

I never found one that I liked enough to keep it more than a few months....

Not enough overdrive? Not enough scream?

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

"the Boss SD-1 and Ibanez Tube Screamer are practically identical. The biggest difference being the diode clipping (assymetrical vs. symetrical)".

The tone stack is different and the SD1 is tighter and crunchier compared to the TS which is smoother and compressed....The diodes are part of it,but the SD1 also has quite a few extra caps in there to make the pedal tight,bright,and more Marshall like....The TS series also uses a 51 pf smoothing cap across the diodes and the SD1 doesn't but uses a different diode arrangement....These changes appear subtle on paper,but the pedals do sound quite a bit different from each other....The Vox Valvetone and the Sparkle Drive are actually alot closer to an actual TS than the Boss SD1...The SD1 has quite a few extras in the circuit that you hear when you A/B them..

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

Not enough overdrive? Not enough scream?

I hate the stock versions of these pedals and I've been tweaking these things for several years!

 

[Scott_F]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

Not enough overdrive? Not enough scream?

Kind of 20 bees buzzing up Barbara Streisand's massive nasal honker kind of tone. :smack:

 

[Dave Z]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

yeah that's the input cap stripping your lows & the feedback cap boosting mids, then you got your tone "stack" (aint much of one) taking off the highs....too much filtering.

Take out some of the filtering (larger value caps on the input & feedback) and it is pretty useful. I'd wager stratedeluxer's mods are along those lines.

 

[ErikH]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

"the Boss SD-1 and Ibanez Tube Screamer are practically identical. The biggest difference being the diode clipping (assymetrical vs. symetrical)".

The tone stack is different and the SD1 is tighter and crunchier compared to the TS which is smoother and compressed....The diodes are part of it,but the SD1 also has quite a few extra caps in there to make the pedal tight,bright,and more Marshall like....The TS series also uses a 51 pf smoothing cap across the diodes and the SD1 doesn't but uses a different diode arrangement....These changes appear subtle on paper,but the pedals do sound quite a bit different from each other....The Vox Valvetone and the Sparkle Drive are actually alot closer to an actual TS than the Boss SD1...The SD1 has quite a few extras in the circuit that you hear when you A/B them..

Yeah, those are some other differences, but circuitwise, looking at the schematics of both, they are so similar it's not funny. It is amazing how a couple of part changes/additions can drastically change the sound of a circuit.

 

[Skarekrough]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

Kind of 20 bees buzzing up Barbara Streisand's massive nasal honker kind of tone. :smack:

I'm certainly not going to question your tonal knowledge, but I typically found that I didn't like ANY overderive pedal when the amp wasn't near breakup and I'd describe the tone as almost exactly that.

Well, maybe just ten bees. As long as Tom Scholz is playing he gets the 20 bees designation in my book.

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

yeah that's the input cap stripping your lows & the feedback cap boosting mids, then you got your tone "stack" (aint much of one) taking off the highs....too much filtering.

Take out some of the filtering (larger value caps on the input & feedback) and it is pretty useful. I'd wager stratedeluxer's mods are along those lines.

Hmmmmmm....Private eye Dave! LOL.....:laugh2:

It's not only parts replacement though....It's really knowing the circuit and "knowing" what part and to what value to change....Kinda like baking a cake and using the right ingredients....I have great ears and I've received some nice reviews from all of you....Thanks again...:beerchug:

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

I'm certainly not going to question your tonal knowledge, but I typically found that I didn't like ANY overderive pedal when the amp wasn't near breakup and I'd describe the tone as almost exactly that.

Well, maybe just ten bees. As long as Tom Scholz is playing he gets the 20 bees designation in my book.

Scott F is a diehard tube amp guy at heart and I respect what he says,but....Some of these pedals can be made to be excellent sounding from just average...

 

[Skarekrough]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

Scott F is a diehard tube amp guy at heart and I respect what he says,but....Some of these pedals can be made to be excellent sounding from just average...

I just thought I would mention it more for the sake of those just getting acquainted with overdrive pedals so they don't make the same mistake I did at one time.

The key ingredient to sounding good is an amp that's being pushed to begin with, or very near it.

There...I said it!

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

Yeah, those are some other differences, but circuitwise, looking at the schematics of both, they are so similar it's not funny. It is amazing how a couple of part changes/additions can drastically change the sound of a circuit.

They are very similar....Notice the tone stack set resistor values and that the TS has that 51pf cap across the diodes(Smoothing cap)....The difference in the way both pedals clip is something we not only hear but feel also....The SD1 also has a .01 cap in the circuit that the TS9 lacks in the early stages of the pedal's gain....

The Valvetone schematic is in fact identical though....

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

I just thought I would mention it more for the sake of those just getting acquainted with overdrive pedals so they don't make the same mistake I did at one time.

The key ingredient to sounding good is an amp that's being pushed to begin with, or very near it.

There...I said it!

We;re still talking about a ss device that creates it's own overdrive or distortion and drives the front end of an amp harder compared to the tone and feel of just an overdriven tube amp creating it's own tube tone...It's alot different for sure..

 

[Scott_F]

Re: The Truth About Tube Screamers

I'm certainly not going to question your tonal knowledge, but I typically found that I didn't like ANY overderive pedal when the amp wasn't near breakup and I'd describe the tone as almost exactly that.

Well, maybe just ten bees. As long as Tom Scholz is playing he gets the 20 bees designation in my book.

I have no tonal knowledge per se. I just know what makes my ears happy.:dance: