This will make me sound like a NOOB.

[korovamilkdud]

Why does my rig sound better at lower volumes than higher ones? I hear so much more detail at lower volumes, even though the valve junkees will constantly scream "crank you volume!". Is it a speaker issue, amp design issue, or tube issue?

For some reason, a riddle I've yet to resolve, my rig sounds better at modest volumes than at high ones. So, yeah, discuss. What would be the cause of a loss of clarity at higher volumes?

 

[jeremy]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

could be lots of things. whats the rig?

 

[korovamilkdud]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

Splawn Quickrod, 4x12, WGS Veteran 30 and Green Beret.

You're always right there, aren't you J?

 

[marvar]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

I can't answer your question, but I can comment-
We have been trying out guitar players- so far, all of them sound like crap- many of them can play, but they have what I call bedroom syndrome- they set their amps to sound great when they are playing alone, but when they come to a band setting, it just doesn't cut it, most of the sound coming out sounds like a 'bag of bees', or has so many effects you can't discern notes. and they say "thats my sound- it sounds great at home" but it just doesn't translate into a band setting- go figure!

 

[korovamilkdud]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

I can't answer your question, but I can comment-
We have been trying out guitar players- so far, all of them sound like crap- many of them can play, but they have what I call bedroom syndrome- they set their amps to sound great when they are playing alone, but when they come to a band setting, it just doesn't cut it, most of sound coming out sounds like a 'bag of bees'. and they say "thats my sound- it sounds great at home" but it just doesn't translate into a band setting- go figure!

Oh my...I may be moments away from answering my own question....

Well, they use too many highs and confuse feel and response for "tone"...

One thing I can say is that Bedroom for me has wooden floors and drywall...yup, tons of hard reflective surface. So I wonder if that might be the culprit.

 

[Pink Unicorn Horsey]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

Well, here's another perspective: Do other people think your rig sounds better at lower volumes? Maybe it's just you.

- Keith

 

[jeremy]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

eq change is a big part of it. with the volume on 2 i run bass and treble at about 5, with the volume on 4 i run the bass on 3 and treble on 6.

loud stuff in bouncy rooms usually = mud

 

[korovamilkdud]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

indeed. It's why my favorite gigs were always outdoors.

 

[apj]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

I remember when I got my first tube amp I had read somewhere that the presence knob was first designed to kind of accomodate for this where you are supposed to gradually turn it up as you turn the volume up and this somewhat accounts for the tone change at different volumes

 

[Mr Wolf]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

I would suggest play about with the eq. Sometimes what sounds good at low volumes and/or certain places can sound different at higher volumes/different venues. My eg settings on the same amp vary from gig to gig. The last two being good examples... one was in a club, another one in a church crypt.

 

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

Noob.......




































































Stuff may sound ugly, then in band surroundings, they seem to work...sometimes.
Turning down stuff usually helps.

 

[GoDrex]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

One thing I found years ago when I had a half stack is, the more I turned up, the more I needed to back off of the gain a bit. Lots of distortion sounds better at a lower volume. When you crank it up it become more like static. Might not be relevant to your situation though.

 

[glassman]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

You could put the amp outside and use the window to control the volume...?!?!

 

[korovamilkdud]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

You could put the amp outside and use the window to control the volume...?!?!

Maybe cover it in a thick blanket soaked in flammable liquids?:firedevil

 

[BloodRose]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

Oh my...I may be moments away from answering my own question....

Well, they use too many highs and confuse feel and response for "tone"...

One thing I can say is that Bedroom for me has wooden floors and drywall...yup, tons of hard reflective surface. So I wonder if that might be the culprit.

I figure at low volume, you are filling that "alive" room with sound and it sounds HUGE.. When you crank up, the waves are bouncing all over and getting muddled. Prob need to get some sound deading panels . Also, as another posted, turn the gain down some.
Im enduring the same thing.. Im worried now that I may be in Marvar's group of players.. Im so used to playing for myself.. I LOVE the power of cranking up, but I sound cruddy. My limits show soon and in my room its very enclosed so I have to watch feedback and such.

But.. OH, the feeling of shaking floors and walls!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[korovamilkdud]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

I figure at low volume, you are filling that "alive" room with sound and it sounds HUGE.. When you crank up, the waves are bouncing all over and getting muddled. Prob need to get some sound deading panels . Also, as another posted, turn the gain down some.
Im enduring the same thing.. Im worried now that I may be in Marvar's group of players.. Im so used to playing for myself.. I LOVE the power of cranking up, but I sound cruddy. My limits show soon and in my room its very enclosed so I have to watch feedback and such.

But.. OH, the feeling of shaking floors and walls!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Still sounds great at reasonable volumes, yup. I also noticed it sounded a lot better after putting the back on the cab. I used to play it open. Closed up FTW.

 

[guitfiddle]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

My guess is that you aren't clipping the power amp. I've read here and other places that all amps run in a class a mode until they are pushed into clipping.

Class A operation is characterised by making the amp do a perfect version of the input signal, and when you turn that amp up to a certain level, some of the input signal gets chopped off (clipping) at the power amp so you don't hear every detail any more.

 

[sosomething]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

As you turn up and push the power tubes harder, you don't need as much gain from the preamp. Try backing off the gain a bit.

Also, turn your highs and presence down. Maybe even WAY down. Hell, on my Splawn (which is only EVER played at band volumes) I have the presence knob completely all the way down.

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

All good points here, from my own experiences. As you feed more power to the speakers, the tonal response changes....it takes more power to amplify bass frequencies that it does to amplify treble frequencies. So yes, changing EQ as the volume is changed is often required. I imagine that the speakers are behaving differently too at different power levels, and their response probably changes to some degree (depending on their power rating in relation to the power being delivered to them).

Also, as the power stage approaches clipping, it becomes almost like a form of compression....so when you play a decent-sized amp at home, it may be operating at a lower volume setting and will obviously not have the classic tube overdrive thing going on, but the cleans will be big and wide and warm and detailed, very dynamic. As it gets cranked into rockin' territory, some of that detail seems to get lost in the trade for the driven tones.

And yes, I've always felt that the higher the amp is cranked, the less overdrive/ distortion is needed, as the power stage will take care of more of that, and do it better than any pedal. Because i've always used valve amps, i've only ever found it neccesary to use an overdrive pedal, never a distortion pedal. (keep in mind i don't really get into the modern metal territory sonically).

The problem with all that is that for people like me who don't use master-volume amps, the sweet spot on one amp means you are stuck with that volume, and if you have to turn it up or down, your sound will change. As a teenager i worked this out, and had to find a solution (this was all a few years before the advent of the master volume control). So....i figured the only way was to own several amps of different power. I still do that now, though of course now i can build amps with switchable output power. But i do realise that most people now need a simple rig that can cover a wide variey of playing situations, and i imagine the master-volume amps are a great benefit for them to be able to do all their playing, rehearsing and gigging with the one amp.

 

[jeremy]

Re: This will make me sound like a NOOB.

I've read here and other places that all amps run in a class a mode until they are pushed into clipping.

i think thats bs, very few amps run in actual class a except single ended amps.