Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

[Mad-Max]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

I was at band practice once where I brought my Mesa Mark V Head and I hooked it up to a Marshall 1960B cab with the G12T-75's in it. I was borrowing a cab because I didn't really feel like hauling my big ass Mesa cab around, because it's heavy as hell for me to carry all by myself.

So I plugged in, and we were playing a few tunes and then I started to jam by myself, and I got a really spot on imitation of that old school Metallica tone from the first 3 records. Quite honestly, I was enjoying it quite a bit. I'm typically more of a Vintage 30 kinda guy since my Mesa cab has them in it (Although I've been REALLY jonesing for some Creambacks, Yum!), but I was getting a really sweet tone out of the G12T-75's.

I do agree with a couple of the above statements that it's one of those speakers that has to have the right amp plugged into it, or else it just won't work. Luckily for me, it was working quite nicely. Would I automatically trade out the V30's for them? no, but it would be a tone that works and is more than usable.

 

[DeadandBuried]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

Pre-Rola generall refers to Celestions made before they moved to their Ipswitch factory (They were previously made in Suffolk) and started putting "ROLA CELESTION" on the labels for a short time. The Rola thing is nothing new, because Rola bought out Celestion all the way back in 1947. But when the move and label changed, some of the specs on certain speakers changed, one of them being the Vintage 30. Which is why both Marshall and Mesa have their own versions of the Vintage 30 made.

As far as making your 1960 sound like a Mesa, about the only thing in Mesa's lineup that is comparable is a Stiletto cab. IIRC, even the standard Rectifier cab has almost an extra cubic foot of volume. A set of Mesa labled Vintage 30s (all three sound slightly different) would help, though.

Ah well then it sounds like neither speaker will be any comparison to a Mesa haha. Might just go with the Marshall branded one in that case, just need low end and loads of mids!

 

[El Supremo]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

I like 'em for clean and single coil stuff. Since I play mostly humbuckers and insist one a good distorted tone I went with G12-65 for my Marshall and ditched my 4×12.

Listened to a couple of recordings I did with my old 4×12 cab and sounds good in the mix though, as cymbals and the like make the fizzy high end dissapear. There was more effort involved in getting a good tone as I was using a para EQ at the time in addition to amp EQ.
Nowadays I can set everything at noon without additional EQ and it sounds good to go. Doesn't get too boomy nor too harsh when tweaking. Life is just so much easier once you get the right speaker for your setup.

 

[xxxplorer]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

I didn't think the V30 was even old enough to be 'pre-rola'. I thought the mesa and marshall versions were just made in the UK and handled 70 watts instead of 60 no?

 

[guitfiddle]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

I have one in my Randall RM50, and with the controls set right, it sounds plenty fat and full. I always run my mids higher than treble or bass, so that must help.

 

[Gone_Shootin]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

Ah well then it sounds like neither speaker will be any comparison to a Mesa haha. Might just go with the Marshall branded one in that case, just need low end and loads of mids!

They're all supposed to be similar, but with subtle differences. The standard one is sharper, of not harsher in certain instance, the Marshall is supposed ti be smoother overall, and the Mesa is supposed to be darker sounding. Of course this is just according to what I dug up when I got bored and started researching tye V30 variants. YMMV.

 

[DeadandBuried]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

They're all supposed to be similar, but with subtle differences. The standard one is sharper, of not harsher in certain instance, the Marshall is supposed ti be smoother overall, and the Mesa is supposed to be darker sounding. Of course this is just according to what I dug up when I got bored and started researching tye V30 variants. YMMV.

Hmm well its to go with a Peavey 6505+ head so very high gain and heavy. Play drop tuned chug chug metalcore type music so you can get an idea of what kinda sound we are going for.

I think these bands used a Mesa cab:

 

[DeadandBuried]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

And

 

[Gone_Shootin]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

I didn't think the V30 was even old enough to be 'pre-rola'. I thought the mesa and marshall versions were just made in the UK and handled 70 watts instead of 60 no?

I didn't either, but according to a few things I dug up, there is a Pre-Rola version. But that just may have heen a spec change that happened along the way or some change when they started making the V30 in China.

 

[Simon_F]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

You'd hope that if G12T-75s were as bad as many people say then Marshall wouldn't keep using them as standard in their speaker cabs! Personally I much prefer G12H-30s and Vintage 30s, either alone or in combination. I play mostly with low/medium gain - I suspect G12T-75s work better with higher gain.

 

[Little Pigbacon]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

^ It's really more the texture of the gain that makes or breaks it.

 

[El Supremo]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

You'd hope that if G12T-75s were as bad as many people say then Marshall wouldn't keep using them as standard in their speaker cabs! Personally I much prefer G12H-30s and Vintage 30s, either alone or in combination. I play mostly with low/medium gain - I suspect G12T-75s work better with higher gain.

Actually, they just need to be cranked up paint peeling loud. I suspect they'll fare better for most people in a 2×12.

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

Break them in, play them loud, and they sound great. They do work better with some amps, usually middy/upper middy amps are best combo. I like them mixed with V30 too.

Use your EQ, turn down the presence knob.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

So, i installed G12H30 Anniversary / Vintage 30 in my 1960 A 4x12 cab. nothing better, still i have to turn presence and treble at 0 and my volume control of SH5 Custom bridge pickup goes to 7. at those settings with gain cranked and a little push from Boss SD1 i have some serious thrash metal tones. but i am talking about thrash metal riffs and rhythm playing, palm muted hi gain crushing. for that it works. but for solos.. it seems i would have the treble and presence even at 0 or lower. so here iam talking about reducing the treble much more than just to 0. and with V30 in x pattern i have the mids on 0 too.. so the settings: presence 0, middle 0, treble 0, bass on full, master volume at 8, preamp gain at about half, and slightly boost from SD-1. the amp is JCM 800 2204, with some mods for high gain. i think maybe the speakers ain't the right ones especially Vintage 30,but is there need to remove bright cap from treble to tame those highs ? the valves are JJ EL. i can get nice Black Sabbath tone with the preamp on 2 of 10, boosted with SD-1. wtf is going on ? if i want zeppelin, cream, hendrix sound i must go into low input. the low input sounded better, there i would have eq set normally: everything at about half with no harsh problems... wtf ? and i forgot to mention, i am missing a bit more low end too....

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

Maybe you hooked them up out of phase? Shouldn't be that bright... or maybe I'm misunderstanding, that was hard to read.

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

I like the V30s. I have them in my 112 DC-3 combo and my 212 Maverick combo, and in a 212 horizontal Recto cab. I like the EVM speakers with my Mark IIIs and Mark IV combos with the EVM Thiele cabs. With my Mark III head, I have 412 Mesa Halfback cab with C90s in the open top and EVMs in the bottom. I love that cab!

With my new Mark V combo, I'm using the C-90 in the combo and then stacking the amp on a Mesa 112 Wide-body Closed Back cab with a V-30, which is a ported cab, like the original Mesa Thiele cabs. This is a really great set up--I'm liking it better than the head + 412 V30 Recto cab I tried. I like the combo of the open back and closed back cabs, and the V-30 delivers some serious low-end.

I don't know the Celestion line that well: I've had the V-30s and C-90s; I had an -85 in a old Marshall JCM 800 4010 combo I had, and one of the Mesa Mark III combos currently has a -100 in it. I'm a bit ambivalent about that one. I think it is a bit too edgy for my tastes in that amp. One of my friends has a old 212 small Bassman or Bandmaster cab with the 50-watt Celestions--that sounded awesome.

Question: which of the Celesions is most/least desirable: -70, -75, , -80 (C-90), -85, -100?

Inquiring minds want to know...

Bill

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

Question: which of the Celesions is most/least desirable: -70, -75, , -80 (C-90), -85, -100?

Inquiring minds want to know...

Bill

Its got to be 70 as least. I once demoed two 4x12s, one with 70s and the other with 75s and the one with 75s sounded down right warm compared to the one with the 70s.

 

[El Supremo]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

I have an unmodded JMP 2104 myself (basically a 2204 in combo housing). You may want to try cranking the preamp gain as that will add some bass on these amps. Other than that...

We may assume you have the power tubes biased? Too low may result in harsher and thinner tone. JJ's are perceived as pretty warm sounding overall.
Speakers could also be out of phase like King IzzO))) mentioned. That would certainly lead to lack of low end.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

Out of phase? i don't think so... i connected all 4 speakers right the + to + and the - to - . maybe some of harshness coming from new speakers, the G12H30 Annies are still not broken in well. about tubes. all are JJ EL, exept in V1 is one hotter, really hotter, more powerful tube, as the builder says to me it helps them to get some more gain. but i don't really know which tube is in V1. all i now it's one different than other JJ EL in all posiitions, except V1 .

 

[El Supremo]

Re: Those G12T-75's drives me crazy...

V1 is usually the tube closest to the input, but I'm not talking about those.
I'm talking about the power tubes (the 2 big ones). When you installed them (or had them installed) you did bring them up to proper bias or...?