Unmatched HB bobbin windings

[esandes]

I'm aware the brobucker has unmatched bobbin windings. What other SD HBs are? The Seth's must be too right? And the 59?

 

[jeremy]

most all duncan buckers are symmetrically wound including the seth and 59

 

[ItsaBass]

The '59/Custom Hybrid is the most obvious example. I'm not sure that anything else on the standard production line is deliberately mismatched.

 

[AlexR]

No, Duncan don't go down that route at all with any of the 'single origin' pickups.

 

[Clint 55]

You have to make ur own by hybridizing a neck and bridge set.

 

[Mincer]

The P-Rail & Hybrid are the ones off the top of my head. There has been lots of talk on this forum about creating your own Hybrids, but it doesn't seem to be a thing that SD concentrates on. They tend to stick with more vintage-inspired designs. Symmetrical coils have the best hum-reduction, though.

 

[PFDarkside]

IMO, there are two completely different things here.
1. Mismatched in the sense that you have the same gauge, same winding pattern, but a “slightly” to “substantial” mismatch on each bobbin.
2. Mismatched like the C/59 hybrid where the gauges are different, DCR and inductance are different, etc.

I remember Dimarzio having a patent on twin resonance technology or something. Which scenario does that apply to above and is it still in place?

 

[esandes]

IMO, there are two completely different things here.
1. Mismatched in the sense that you have the same gauge, same winding pattern, but a “slightly” to “substantial” mismatch on each bobbin.
2. Mismatched like the C/59 hybrid where the gauges are different, DCR and inductance are different, etc.

I remember Dimarzio having a patent on twin resonance technology or something. Which scenario does that apply to above and is it still in place?

I meant #1. Like the original PAFs. Gibson burstbuckers are still mismatched intentionally. Some say pickups are more airy when mismatched. I don't notice any hum with the mismatch.

 

[ItsaBass]

I meant #1. Like the original PAFs. Gibson burstbuckers are still mismatched intentionally. Some say pickups are more airy when mismatched. I don't notice any hum with the mismatch.

Firstly, IME, Gibson Burstbuckers being mismatched is not true. They are mismatched no more than any other Gibson pickups – at least the ones I've owned.

"Airy" doesn't mean much, on an objective level, so its use doesn't have much bearing on the facts of the matter. With the level of mismatch that you see in Burstbuckers (and most other humbuckers), you get slight accentuations of certain frequencies, and slight attenuations of others. But again, these mismatches are common on almost all humbuckers, and almost always random, not "tuned" by design.

DiMarzio does indeed "tune" their coils differently sometimes, to have deliberate frequency effects, on at least a few of their humbuckers. But with Duncan and Gibson, it's almost always random.

 

[PFDarkside]

I meant #1. Like the original PAFs. Gibson burstbuckers are still mismatched intentionally. Some say pickups are more airy when mismatched. I don't notice any hum with the mismatch.

That’s what I think of as well, and for the same reason. A little more high end due to fewer cancelations.

 

[esandes]

Firstly, IME, Gibson Burstbuckers being mismatched is not true.

:bsflag:

 

[AlexR]

^ Zhangbucker too has measured the coils of BB's he's had come through his workshop, and found them no more or less mismatched than any other pickup designed to be symmetrically wound.

 

[esandes]

Gibson advertises the BB to have a mismatch while the 57/57+ are symmetrical. With 4900/4700 winds can you measure the difference? The percentage difference in winds is tiny. Probably less than the instrument accuracy.

 

[jeremy]

200 turns is within tolerance but a measurable difference

 

[dystrust]

IMO, there are two completely different things here.
1. Mismatched in the sense that you have the same gauge, same winding pattern, but a “slightly” to “substantial” mismatch on each bobbin.
2. Mismatched like the C/59 hybrid where the gauges are different, DCR and inductance are different, etc.

I remember Dimarzio having a patent on twin resonance technology or something. Which scenario does that apply to above and is it still in place?

DiMarzio's patent covered #2 but it has since expired, which is why the '59/Custom Hybrid is a production model now. When I first heard about the Hybrid in 2004, the DiMarzio patent was still in effect, so SD couldn't legally make them.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

It doesn't take a lot of coil asymmetry to help open up the highs on a humbucker.
I'm not a winder but my impression is that an offset of 4-5% is not too uncommon.

Burstbuckers have a screw coil that's wound about 4% hotter than their slug coil.
I found the BB2 fairly harsh at the bridge in a bright sounding LesPaul, but they sound vintage-crisp in many guitars.

Later, Gibson released the MHS pickups with the slug coil hotter instead, for similarly open character but a different tone profile.
The bridge pickup on these is noticeably warmer, and the neck is very vintagey with an A3 magnet like the Custombuckers have.

Gibson makes another MHS set more like early-60s "patent number" pickups, with symmetrical coils & short A5 magnets.
These are called MHS II to differentiate them from the earlier model, now known as the MHS I set.

 

[jeremy]

dimarzios patent was for two coils with nominally the same # of turns but different wire size, so 5500 turns of #42 on one coil and 5500 #43 on the other. not sure what the turn count is on the hybrid