L
Little Pigbacon
Guest
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
It's gotta have those bent steel saddles, and I like a six-screw trem mount.
It's gotta have those bent steel saddles, and I like a six-screw trem mount.
What makes a really great Strat?
- Thread starter PFDarkside
- Start date
Drunken Bowling
New member
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
Bell-like clean tone in the second position.
Did pre-CBS Strats have a second position? If not, they should have.
Bell-like clean tone in the second position.
Did pre-CBS Strats have a second position? If not, they should have.
L
Little Pigbacon
Guest
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
The earliest Strats had a three-way switch -- one pickup at a time. Players found thay could make the switch catch between positions and get those parallel 2 & 4 sounds. At some point Fender started making them with a five-way switch.
The earliest Strats had a three-way switch -- one pickup at a time. Players found thay could make the switch catch between positions and get those parallel 2 & 4 sounds. At some point Fender started making them with a five-way switch.
Bludave
New member
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
The 5 way switches didn't come out until the 80's if my memory is right but listen to any Jini Hendrix record and you can hear him in between on many tracks. It was driving other players nuts trying to figure out how he did it. A local repair guy here actually started making then in the very early 80's. using a drill to create a detent to keep the switch in place, then switch craft. Mass produced them and the rest is history. There is something pure about a three way switch. When I bought my 57 RI Strat in 87 it had a 3 way in it. I left it in for a whe but love the 5 way so much better
The 5 way switches didn't come out until the 80's if my memory is right but listen to any Jini Hendrix record and you can hear him in between on many tracks. It was driving other players nuts trying to figure out how he did it. A local repair guy here actually started making then in the very early 80's. using a drill to create a detent to keep the switch in place, then switch craft. Mass produced them and the rest is history. There is something pure about a three way switch. When I bought my 57 RI Strat in 87 it had a 3 way in it. I left it in for a whe but love the 5 way so much better
PFDarkside
of the Forum
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
That's kind of what I'm getting at. I know its dangerous to list specs and expect a guitar to sound good.... It seems like a good body, a good neck, and most importantly a body and neck that work well together are big keys. Also steel block and stamped steel saddles seem to be important as well. Add in a vintage style neck (truss rod) and of course the appropriate pickups and I should be in the ballpark I'd think?
That's kind of what I'm getting at. I know its dangerous to list specs and expect a guitar to sound good.... It seems like a good body, a good neck, and most importantly a body and neck that work well together are big keys. Also steel block and stamped steel saddles seem to be important as well. Add in a vintage style neck (truss rod) and of course the appropriate pickups and I should be in the ballpark I'd think?
PFDarkside
of the Forum
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
Imagine in the pre-internet days how that nugget of knowledge spread around guitar playing teenage circles... "Man, you can wedge the switch in between to sound like Jimi!"
Imagine in the pre-internet days how that nugget of knowledge spread around guitar playing teenage circles... "Man, you can wedge the switch in between to sound like Jimi!"
mojosman
New member
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
I have three. All different, and all towards the vintage and of the Strat spectrum. One is a Custom Shop Cray Strat, one is a production SRV Signature Strat, and one is a Partscaster I built to clone Blackie as closely as I could. I think the Partscaster sounds better and more vintage than the other two, but the Cray Strat is very close.
I think you can build what you want, and be happy with the result if you do your homework. I chose every piece based on getting the tone I wanted, which was a vintage 50's tone that Clapton got from Blackie; which was a Partscaster also. I think pickups are the main piece of the puzzle. I chose D. Allen Tru-62 pickups for many reasons. One being that the middle pickup isn't reverse wound. That's how Leo made them, but the sets you see now they are far more likely to be reverse wound middle pickups. I also used machined steel trem block, Callaham vintage saddles, paper in oil tone caps, etc. Do your homework, and buy the best quality parts you can find. Buy used when possible to keep the expense down. Good luck.
I have three. All different, and all towards the vintage and of the Strat spectrum. One is a Custom Shop Cray Strat, one is a production SRV Signature Strat, and one is a Partscaster I built to clone Blackie as closely as I could. I think the Partscaster sounds better and more vintage than the other two, but the Cray Strat is very close.
I think you can build what you want, and be happy with the result if you do your homework. I chose every piece based on getting the tone I wanted, which was a vintage 50's tone that Clapton got from Blackie; which was a Partscaster also. I think pickups are the main piece of the puzzle. I chose D. Allen Tru-62 pickups for many reasons. One being that the middle pickup isn't reverse wound. That's how Leo made them, but the sets you see now they are far more likely to be reverse wound middle pickups. I also used machined steel trem block, Callaham vintage saddles, paper in oil tone caps, etc. Do your homework, and buy the best quality parts you can find. Buy used when possible to keep the expense down. Good luck.
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beaubrummels
Well-known member
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
This
...plus period-spec wire, pots and cap (cloth pushback wire, CTS pots and correct value [in tolerance] cap)
I like how this thread is shaping up. I'm finding it very informational.
This
...plus period-spec wire, pots and cap (cloth pushback wire, CTS pots and correct value [in tolerance] cap)
I like how this thread is shaping up. I'm finding it very informational.
Edgecrusher
Well-known member
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
Thing is this was never how Leo envisioned it. They werent made to have the best metallurgical or electrical anything. The woods that were used were chosen due to their availability and ease of manufacture. Even the ones made in the 50's arent exactly extreme examples of the epitome of luthiery. Leo's idea was to be able to mass produce instruments to that end the formula for a great strat isnt nearly as magical or as mystical as many wine corkers would want you to think.
Thing is this was never how Leo envisioned it. They werent made to have the best metallurgical or electrical anything. The woods that were used were chosen due to their availability and ease of manufacture. Even the ones made in the 50's arent exactly extreme examples of the epitome of luthiery. Leo's idea was to be able to mass produce instruments to that end the formula for a great strat isnt nearly as magical or as mystical as many wine corkers would want you to think.
JeffB
Let it B
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
IME, a strat by design is pretty much a generic blank canvas. Quality of neck (i.e. for tone), bridge, and pickups are the paint. Any of those that are subpar will affect the tone negatively in a big way.
PS,.for the record, IMO positions 2 and 4 should be outlawed and use of such punishable by throwing the guitar player off a cliff.
1/3/5 FTW!!!!!
IME, a strat by design is pretty much a generic blank canvas. Quality of neck (i.e. for tone), bridge, and pickups are the paint. Any of those that are subpar will affect the tone negatively in a big way.
PS,.for the record, IMO positions 2 and 4 should be outlawed and use of such punishable by throwing the guitar player off a cliff.
1/3/5 FTW!!!!!
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crusty philtrum
Vintageologist
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
You're Hank Marvin !!! (i picked it not only from the 'no in between sounds' approach but also the cliff joke ......)...............
PS,.for the record, IMO positions 2 and 4 should be outlawed and use of such punishable by throwing the guitar player off a cliff.
You're Hank Marvin !!! (i picked it not only from the 'no in between sounds' approach but also the cliff joke ......)...............
crusty philtrum
Vintageologist
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
Oh yeah, another element of vintage Strat sound is the use of small fretwire, not large stuff.
Oh yeah, another element of vintage Strat sound is the use of small fretwire, not large stuff.
JeffB
Let it B
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
LOL. How I would LOVE to be able to play like Hank. Phenomenal player, and a huge influence on MY biggest influence (M. Schenker).
I grew up late 70s/early 80s, and the whole overdone OOPhase strat thing drives me ape****. The ONLY guy whose OOP tone I liked was Rory, and that was because he knew how to use his volume and tone controls. Everyone else drives me nuts with that sound. Stateside, its beyond annoying...every blues gig...every Guitar Center....its always some guy quacking away on 2/4. If I want more quack I will go duck hunting :bigthumb:
LOL. How I would LOVE to be able to play like Hank. Phenomenal player, and a huge influence on MY biggest influence (M. Schenker).
I grew up late 70s/early 80s, and the whole overdone OOPhase strat thing drives me ape****. The ONLY guy whose OOP tone I liked was Rory, and that was because he knew how to use his volume and tone controls. Everyone else drives me nuts with that sound. Stateside, its beyond annoying...every blues gig...every Guitar Center....its always some guy quacking away on 2/4. If I want more quack I will go duck hunting :bigthumb:
ratherdashing
Kablamminator
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
Pistols at dawn!
PS,.for the record, IMO positions 2 and 4 should be outlawed and use of such punishable by throwing the guitar player off a cliff.
Pistols at dawn!
JeffB
Let it B
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
LOL. I am sure I ruffle some feather with my comments, , but its just what I do/dont like to hear. Do not expect anyone else to feel the same
LOL. I am sure I ruffle some feather with my comments, , but its just what I do/dont like to hear. Do not expect anyone else to feel the same
Lake Placid Blues
New member
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
I have a book on the strat somewhere by a guy who's name I can't spell. It wasn't as accidental as we think as it turns out. There was quite a bit of trial and error seeing what worked and what didn't. It was designed using gigging guitarists' input. Mostly country guitarists of the time. There was a country guitarist that did the primary beta testing. He would take a prototype and gig with it and come back and give Leo and the boys input on how it went. The trem required considerable trial and error re-designing before they settled on the production design. They experimented with mahogony bodies and hickory necks during the pre-cbs years as well.
I have a book on the strat somewhere by a guy who's name I can't spell. It wasn't as accidental as we think as it turns out. There was quite a bit of trial and error seeing what worked and what didn't. It was designed using gigging guitarists' input. Mostly country guitarists of the time. There was a country guitarist that did the primary beta testing. He would take a prototype and gig with it and come back and give Leo and the boys input on how it went. The trem required considerable trial and error re-designing before they settled on the production design. They experimented with mahogony bodies and hickory necks during the pre-cbs years as well.
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
The neck is probably the deciding factor for me. The neck profile on SRV signature (big frets, flat radius) is perfect.
I don't really care what kind of wood were used, as long as it has great resonance/sustain.
I read larry dimarzio interview a few years ago, where he describe eric clapton's blackie as the most piano-like guitar he ever played. I think that's the holy grail of what makes a great guitar. Probably any pickup in that guitar would sound awesome.
The neck is probably the deciding factor for me. The neck profile on SRV signature (big frets, flat radius) is perfect.
I don't really care what kind of wood were used, as long as it has great resonance/sustain.
I read larry dimarzio interview a few years ago, where he describe eric clapton's blackie as the most piano-like guitar he ever played. I think that's the holy grail of what makes a great guitar. Probably any pickup in that guitar would sound awesome.
Lake Placid Blues
New member
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
Bill Lawrence says he wired up some of Jimi's strats with blend pots.
Bill Lawrence says he wired up some of Jimi's strats with blend pots.
PFDarkside
of the Forum
Re: What makes a really great Strat?
Unfortunately I don't think we have unearthed any secret way to select a body and wood in this thread. It still seems to come down to playing some until the "better" ones make themselves known.
However, to capture that sound you still need to duplicate what was used. Otherwise there would be no difference in a great Strat and a cheap import! Pot metal bridge, plywood body, huge neck reinforcement, etc. I get your point that if Leo Fender was around and invented the Strat today, he very well may have created the Cort factory in Korea or even the Chinese factories. I also grant the fact that Fenders are NOT an epitome of luthiery, but they DID use materials and processes that were "better" than cheap guitar manufactures use today.
Unfortunately I don't think we have unearthed any secret way to select a body and wood in this thread. It still seems to come down to playing some until the "better" ones make themselves known.
