Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

S

stu42

New member
I've searched this forum and found a number of posts that are similar to what I'm looking for but not exactly.

What I'm looking for is a wiring diagram to connect two P-rails to a 4p5t Super 5-way switch with a push/pull tone control.

So far I have the two P-rails connected with the 4p5t switch (without the push-pull switch) but it's wired only for single coil sounds...like this:

1. Bridge P-90
2. Bridge Rail
3. Bridge and Neck Rail (in parallel)
4. Neck Rail
5. Neck P-90

I'm really liking these tones but now I'd like to expand the configuration by adding the push-pull switch. If possible I'd like to keep the previous configuration on one push-pull switch setting and then add the following on the second push-pull switch setting:

1. Bridge Series Humbucker
2. Bridge Parallel Humbucker
3. Bridge and Neck Parallel Humbucker (in parallel)
4. Neck Parallel Humbucker
5. Neck Series Humbucker

Is this possible? Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Could prove tricky.

Have you actually tested the second set of five sounds yet? (Temporarily twisting conductor ends together would suffice.)

Some Ibanez dual humbucker guitars use a five-way lever selector switch to achieve the same Neck Series Humbucker and Neck Parallel Humbucker combinations that you mention. I shall have to take a look inside my S Classic to see how they do it.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

I kind of doubt if it's possible to do this with a push pull, though I'm not even in the same league with an ArtieToo or hermetico. What is your setup as far as tone and volume controls? The reason I ask is that things are a lot simpler with a single master volume and master tone control. Also, are you using rings, or mounting the humbuckers directly to a pickguard? Using triple shot rings would open up a lot of options. You could get everything (and then some) with a set of triple shots, even using a 3-way, tele-type switch. With a super-switch, you could add options for having bridge and neck HBs in series with each other as well as parallel (aka coil swapping) and maybe and out-of-phase option as well. That's dead simple with a master tone/master vol. setup. Not quite sure how to do it with independent vol. & tone controls.
 
Last edited:
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Hello, again.

Just looked at the Ibanez S Classic selector switch. It is a Japanese PCB design. The contact layout cannot only offer the five settings that Ibanez requested. There would be no point in sourcing a circuit diagram for this switch.

On a more general level, your desired circuit boils down to the following:
1) A bridge/both/neck pickup selector
2) A P90/both/Rail mode selector
3) A humbucker Series/Parallel mode selctor

It might be possible to get what you want from a three-way selector switch and a couple of mode switches.

I would expect a schematic diagram for the three-way P-Rails mode switch to appear on the SD website Support area.

In your desired circuit, the series/parallel mode switch needs to operate on both pickups simultaneously. I would use a DP4T mini switch.

The tricky bit in this circuit is not letting the "humbucker" S/P mode switch interfere with the single coil options.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Okay...thanks. I'll have to think about what you guys have said so I can make sense of it. In the meantime...here's more details of my setup.

The guitar is a Godin LGXT with a single volume and single tone control. I was really hoping to continue to use the 5-way switch. Ideally I'd like to not have to put another hole in the guitar to mount another switch - hence the push-pull selector - but if needed I'd be open to it.

I know very little about wiring but I have been trying to learn. I imagine there are a fair number of options available with the combination of the 4p5t switch plus a push-pull. However, I don't know enough about the wiring to know what modes are possible to achieve in each switch position. I want to make it functional with useful combinations that are easy to switch between without having to adjust too many things at once.

If I had to really boil it down to one thing I really want is that I'd like to add the option to have a bridge humbucker setting. In other words, keep the switching options I have now but just add a switch that simply activates the bridge pickup in humbucking mode by itself and basically disables the other 5-way switch....sort of like on the MusicMan Steve Morse guitar which has a switch that activates the "pickup 3" regardless of where the other switch & lever are set. I'd have to decide whether I want it in series or parallel mode though. Is that possible?

Having said that...I'm still interested to know what other options are available with the combination of a 4p5t switch plus a push-pull.

Cheers
 
Last edited:
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

The sticking point in your proposed circuit is that switching the P-Rail dual coil combinations between series and parallel involves sending the red and white conductors to different destinations.

Doing this via the 24-contact mega-switch would occupy up twelve of the available contacts.

Even my earlier suggestion of using DP3T (on-off-on) and 4PDT (on-on) mini switches has its problems. I am 99% certain that switching the red and white conductors from series to parallel will shut off some of the other modes on the P90/HB/Rail mode switch.

The Seymour Duncan website has several schematic diagrams for the P-Rails pickup. These are filed under Humbuckers.

From these, you should be able to deduce that even a pair of push-pull pots is unlikely to fulfil your switching requirements. Your basic idea is fine. It is just awkward to deliver it in an easy to use and cosmetically acceptable way. Sorry.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

If the SS is wired using only 2 poles to achieve the current setup, use the other 2 poles for the additional setup, and select between the 2 setups using one push/pull. Use the other push/pull for whatever routing is needed (i.e. White to Ground for Parallel).
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Are the wafers of a SuperSwitch hard-wired together from the factory? All I've used are old Jackson Special 5-way switches. They are similar in construction (2 wafers, tabs galore) to a SS, but from what I've seen of the SS diagrams, the switching is slightly different (the Jackson goes 5,1,2,3,4/1,2,3,4,5 on each wafer).

With the Jackson, if you want the two wafers to talk to each other, you have to manually wire them together, even if you're using one pole for one set of connections and another pole for another set (typical H-S-H wiring, etc).
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

The megaswitch used by Fender organises its contacts as two lots of this.

WIPER 1 2 3 4 5 (gap) 1 2 3 4 5 WIPER

If you start employing one set of twelve just to complete the automatic series/parallel switching of the P-Rails' two coils in "humbucker" mode, that only leaves the other twelve contacts to select the actual neck and/or bridge pickup combinations.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Thanks again for the info guys.

How about this then to simplify things...

Keep the existing selections with the push-pull switch in and then with it out have the ability to select
Bridge Parallel Humbucker
Bridge and Neck Parallel Humbucker (in parallel)
Neck Parallel Humbucker

I realize that's only covering three selections on a 5-way switch but I'm not sure what else I'd want. I think I'd prefer the PAF'ish sound of the humbuckers in parallel.

?

Cheers
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

I'm assuming you're wired like this currently?

2PRSS2PP-1.jpg



oops. Ignore the black neck pickup wire going to the Push/Pull - that should be going to the SS.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

I keep coming back to the notion that you would be better off with a three-way neck/both/bridge selector switch and a P90/HB/Rail mode switch. Your version of this would require the "humbucker" mode to be wired in parallel rather than series. Otherwise, it is exactly like the 2xP-Rails, 1 Vol, 1 Tone schematic on the Duncan website.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

DrNewcenstein said:
With the Jackson, if you want the two wafers to talk to each other, you have to manually wire them together, even if you're using one pole for one set of connections and another pole for another set (typical H-S-H wiring, etc).
Click to expand...

Same with the SuperSwitch, but if you set up 2 poles (one wafer) of it to do splitting and series/parallel and such then it'll still be making those connections even if you still take the output from another wafer. Unless you also have your push/pull make and break all the jumpers, which'd mean an awful lot of poles.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Every sound that you said you wanted from your guitar is possible using this schematic diagram.

http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/wiring-diagrams/schematics.php?schematic=2_prails_2v_2t_tspp

Obviously, for your purposes, it will be necessary to substitute a Telecaster-style three-way lever selector switch for the Switchcraft toggle in the schematic.

If you only have Master Volume and Master Tone control pots, you need to simply this area section of the schematic too.

If all else fails, I will print out a copy of the schematic, redraw the relevant parts of it and e-mail you a picture of it. How about that?
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Nuts! My typing sucks today.

That should have read ...SIMPLIFY this AREA of the schematic...

Must engage brain before committing words to page.

P. S. - Before anyone asks, Triple Shots will not work for this circuit.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Well then, looks like a TripleShot would be the best way for the soldering, but will require flipping more than 2 switches to get certain combos.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

No. In the Duncan schematic that I am recommending, each "half" of the DPDT switch on the push-pull pots acts per mode rather than per pickup. (Does this statement make sense?)

Look up the diagram called, "2 P-Rails 2 Volume, 2 Tone, 3 Way 2 push/pull (option #2)"

This diagram includes an explanation of what each of the push-pulls does.

Triple Shot mounting surrounds only make sense for schematic diagram Option #1
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

Yes, it makes sense. Each p/p affects both pickups at the same time.

However, as you say, TripleShots will work for Option #1.


As well, TSs will work on each pickup individually, and you can mix both pickups in either of the 3 modes, whereas diagrams 1 and 2 will only give you both rails, both 90s, or both humbucking.


TS switching can be duplicated with a SuperSwitch so you get all those options, using one push/pull to select between what he's got wired now and what he wants to add if the SS is split into 2 2-pole groups (Volume p/p selects between the 2 groups).

White can be sent to the other p/p first and then split between ground and the SS link for Parallel.
 
Re: Wiring 2 P-Rails with 5-way super switch?

You are entirely correct, DrNewcenstein.

I was concentrating on the ten pickup combinations listed in this thread's original posting.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

E
Tele wiring with push/pull tone
Replies
0
Views
78
echo8287
E
Bloomworks
Telecaster, 4-way Switch, Split Coil and Phase Switch, Wiring problem, Help!!
Replies
3
Views
71
jeremy
jeremy
O
Wiring question 3 single coils
2 3
Replies
59
Views
719
orpheo
O
marcello252
4 way switch with 1 4 conductors humbucker and 1 single coil - wiring needed
Replies
5
Views
73
Artie
Artie
Coma
Confused by S/P wiring diagrams
Replies
5
Views
186
Coma
Coma
Back
Top