Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

[Low_fidelity2100]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

There are 2 things abotu G12T75's...one they are mid scooped which means that they will have trouble cuttiong through a band mix ion top of that they are only 97db efficient meaning that they are simply not very loud speakers. Try a paif of G12H30's or Vintage 30's and see where that gets you.

+1 for different speakers.

Also, how are you setting the eq on the amp itself? Cause that will make a HUGE difference in whether your heard or not. A tone that sounds great on its own, might not cut through with a full band (esspeically with a second guitarist). So while your amp could actually be louder, you'll still not be able to hear yourself when the band kicks in. Cause your getting drown out by The drummer, Bass player, and Other guitarist.

Try Cranking the Mids, Treble on 6-8, cut the bass down to 3 or so, Presence on 6-8. That and Different speakers should help cut through better.

[Kommerzbassist]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

Ah and just another thing in case you didn't know... double the wattage on an amp is only about 10% louder when full on.

[Hot _Grits]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

All the above suggestions are good, but one option could be that the other guitar player is playing way too loud.

-The solution to that would be to get him to turn down or go to a 50w+ amp...

[Kommerzbassist]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

-The solution to that would be to get him to turn down or go to a 50w+ amp...

The watts really aren't the problem here. Watts are merely clean headroom. A 10W amp is about half as loud as a 100W one, since the hearing works in a logarithmic fashion. Double the power means about +3dB.

I think it's mostly a problem with the 2x12 just blowing away his shoes but nothing else...

[Hot _Grits]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

The watts really aren't the problem here. Watts are merely clean headroom. A 10W amp is about half as loud as a 100W one, since the hearing works in a logarithmic fashion. Double the power means about +3dB.

I think it's mostly a problem with the 2x12 just blowing away his shoes but nothing else...

Cab quality, orientation and speaker load are all important issues to consider. And I'm aware of the whole wattage v percieved volume thing. But my solution for running a tube rectified 30w amp alongside a cranked 60w amp would be to up the wattage. I've been in this situation many times before: if you're in a volume war and sound reinforcement/room size/band positioning are against you, getting over 50w is the only guaranteed way you'll get what you need onstage without staring at your cabinet from two feet away.

Of course, getting the other guy to turn down/move his amp would be the first stop...

[J Moose]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

I think it's mostly a problem with the 2x12 just blowing away his shoes but nothing else...

Could be likely...

Another thing to consider is that an open back cab disperses sound fairly evenly, especially in close quarters, while a closed back cab projects outwards and the sound doesn't really develop for several feet.

That being the case, it's entirely possible that a 4x12 cab won't help things.

Yet another possibility is that one of the speakers is blown... driving a short & impedance mismatch which would eat a lot of power.

A healthy JTM45 with a closed back 2x12 cab, regardless of speakers... volume on 10 should keep with or even blow a Deville clear into last week.

[Hot _Grits]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

I dunno, The last two JTM45s I've played have been polite volume-wise. Useable in most stage situations, but my old 2x12 deville would easily have been able to get over the top of them...

[Gr8Scott]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

JTM-45 is a painfully loud amp. Sounds like a weak cab or speakers.

[C-Martin]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

Getting the other guy to change amp is impossible where we're not rich and cant really afford buying amps all the time, and as for the volume like i said he already is limiting his sound just because of this problem barely even hitting 2 on the volume where he could crank it up higher and get the tones he would really wants. Pretty much like any of you if someone tells you to turn your stuff down and change your settings im pretty sure you wont really want to since most of us probably work hard in our search for those tones we really like.

So if the 1922 sucks any suggestion on what cab i could get? 1936 any better or just go for the 1960 with a 4x12 setup? or just switching to the G12H? This amp and cab i bought years ago for the purpose of my own home "entertainment" and never really bought these to use at gigs and such, i'd have probably bought a 4x12 instead for that.. and as for the settings i cant really boost up the highs and such because then it becomes literally painful and harsh sounding, i can hear myself just slightly better if i do that but its just painful and i've been told often to lower the treble because it gets a bit like an ice pick if i try to boost em too much.

Btw i play mainly heavy type stuff with some cleaner parts mixed in and van halen'ish type solos thrown in somewhere if this is any needed info..

[Gr8Scott]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

More speakers equals more volume. Try the 1960 and load it with G12H30 speakers. It won't be cheap, but you'll get much more volume that way. The G12H30's also sound great with a JTM-45. That's what I use with my open back Edana.

[C-Martin]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

maybe just getting a 1960AHW Handwired Cab would do the trick, it says to already come loaded with G12H-30 re-issues

[J Moose]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

Replacing the celestion 75s would probably go a long ways... buying another Marshall cab probably won't. IMO they're pretty overrated & expensive for what they are... much better deals to be had on other things. Especially used cabs. Try to rent or borrow a few before you blindly buy something.

The JTM45 loves Greenbacks, that's the traditional pairing. They're also not "metal" amps... Maybe that's something to think about, a whole new amp?!

Don't underestimate the open back vs. closed back thing...

And getting the cabinet up off the ground.

[kmcguitars]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

Don't underestimate the open back vs. closed back thing...

And getting the cabinet up off the ground.

A Big + 1. I had a SF Showman (100watts) on 8 !! sitting on my 2x12 closed back Cab. I couldn't hear myself?? My pants cuffs where fluttering & Everyone
10ft. in front of me had napkins in their ears. I traded up and got a SF Twin. I never had a problem hearing myself. ( Although that didn't solve the problem with the people w/t napkin's in their ears) LOL!! If your playing in a LOUD band ,In a small place? Open back is the way to go. I had a JTM 45 on loan for a few months... That amp was loud enough to piss off my neighbors .
my guess is you have a projection problem .

[James Rock]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

And getting the cabinet up off the ground.

Should improve tone too as usually with 12's you can't hear much high end when the cabs at floor level as it doesn't diffract as much (meaning doesn't spread out over a small distance as much as lower frequencies). Get it off the floor and put some G12H-30s in there and you should find an improvement in cut and volume.

[Luke Duke]

Re: Marshall JTM-45 vs Fender Tweed amp.. volume problem

If you get a 4x12 you will have the opposite problem, the deville will be BLOWN AWAY!!! I'd order an avatar cab with 2 G12H30s or an H30/V30 mix.

You could buy new speakers, but if you don't buy used you would probably come out just slightly cheaper than buying the avatar cab.

Luke