Duncan SSL1, california set

[Riley]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

If our engineering department thinks it was worth doing, I trust them. It would certainly save time and effort not to have a distinct bridge version. But at the end of the day I would look at the calibrated set as sort of getting the "ideal" balance between the pickups, within the realm of possibility for vintage pickups.

 

[gregory]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

So we're looking at at least 5 different versions of the SSL-1, then?

This is assuming that both sets share one in common, otherwise it could be 6 versions???

 

[Riley]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

As far as I know, there are three versions available - the 'neck', which is the baseline SSL-1 (if you buy an individual SSL-1 this is what you'll get), the 'middle' which is RWRP, but otherwise the same as the 'neck', and the 'bridge', which is overwound just a touch.

The other set to which Boomer refers is a sort of obsolete OEM part, which to my knowledge isn't really available anymore.

 

[PicoRiveraTele]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

The notion that you could have a "calibrated" set with three identical DC resistances strains credibility.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

Well, this is about as official as it gets. Thank you for a definitive answer.

 

[freefrog]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

Too often people play the "off topic" card just to shut down a conversation that somehow bothers them.

“Off topic” as a CARD that people would PLAY?

So, communication here would work as a game to WIN??

For me (and probably for many members here), online discussions are just a few minutes of recreation between busy hours.

The goal (at least for me) is to share some thoughts and findings with other musicians around the World and not to prove anybody wrong.

And when something is off topic, it bothers me because IT IS off topic, distracting me from the subject discussed while my reading time is limited.

The notion that you could have a "calibrated" set with three identical DC resistances strains credibility.

My first answer in this topic was describing the last SSL1 set that I’ve tested: DCR was the same with the 3 PU's, inductance was marginally different (albeit it DID differ, for those who trust only inductance) and… the bridge PU (in its plastic box, not in a guitar) inspired higher readings than the neck and mid SSL’s to our lab teslameter.

We know that high gaussed mags would favor “stratitis” in a neck pickup while it would remedy a bit to the lack of output level often perceived with the bridge unit by those who use 3 similar Strat PU’s.

IMHO, it doesn’t make so suspect the idea of a calibrated set despite of a same DCR.

 

[PicoRiveraTele]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

They specifically used the term "overwound", not "stronger magnet". My oh my, the extent to which people contort and bend to explain away what was probably a simple mistake is astonishing.

Besides, I can see that they have changed the copy on their website. According to post #6 the old copy was:

This three pickup set includes a standard wound neck pickup, an RWRP, reverse wind reverse polarity, middle pickup for clucky in-between tones, and a slightly overwound bridge pickup for easier pickup balance.

and when I go to https://www.seymourduncan.com/pickup/california-50s-set now, I see

This three pickup set includes a standard wound neck and bridge pickup, and an RWRP, reverse wind reverse polarity, middle pickup for noise cancellation in the in-between positions.

So it looks to me like they've retracted the claim that the bridge is overwound, while also maintaining that it is overwound in post #83. This is just silly, obliviously a mistake was made, that has since be sort of / sort of not corrected.

 

[freefrog]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

My oh my, the extent to which people contort and bend to explain away what was probably a simple mistake is astonishing. .

Why satirizing people instead of disagreeing respectfully? What’s the difference between that and trolling?

They specifically used the term "overwound", not "stronger magnet".

Besides, I can see that they have changed the copy on their website. According to post #6 the old copy was:

and when I go to https://www.seymourduncan.com/pickup/california-50s-set now, I see

So it looks to me like they've retracted the claim that the bridge is overwound, while also maintaining that it is overwound in post #83. This is just silly, obliviously a mistake was made, that has since be sort of / sort of not corrected.

So what? Don’t we ALL do mistakes ? Is this one VITAL or even important ?

And does a changing or erroneous online info about the California Set exclude the possibility of a calibration of some kind for this set in the factory?

 

[Jacew]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

So - I seem to have missed this thread while I was out of the office last week.

Here's some info straight from our engineering department:

The California 50's set bill of materials calls for an SSL-1 neck, RWRP middle, and SSL-1 bridge. So we do actually build three versions of the SSL-1 that go into the calibrated set.

The difference is subtle, only a few hundred turns, but the bridge pickup is in fact slightly overwound compared to the neck and middle.

I'm still catching up on this thread, but if there are any other questions still hanging let me know and I'll do my best to answer them!

This is really interesting.

1) Can anyone confirm if there's any noticeable difference in tone between those "neck" and "bridge" models?

2) Can they be differentiated from each other visually? (Does set pickups have different markings/labels on them anyway?)

3) Was the mention of higher output bridge removed from webpage simply to avoid confusion? I guess it was correct in the first place after all...

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

This is really interesting.

1) Can anyone confirm if there's any noticeable difference in tone between those "neck" and "bridge" models?

2) Can they be differentiated from each other visually? (Does set pickups have different markings/labels on them anyway?)

3) Was the mention of higher output bridge removed from webpage simply to avoid confusion? I guess it was correct in the first place after all...

Hasn’t much of this already been confirmed via Riley and the Seymour Duncan Engineering Department?

 

[Jacew]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

Hasn’t much of this already been confirmed via Riley and the Seymour Duncan Engineering Department?

Only that different models of SSL-1's do exist (or at least have existed at some point). I'd like to know more.

If that "SSL-1 bridge" indeed differs from regular SSL-1's, I want to find one!

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

Only that different models of SSL-1's do exist (or at least have existed at some point). I'd like to know more.

If that "SSL-1 bridge" indeed differs from regular SSL-1's, I want to find one!

I get the impression you’ll have to buy a set.

I’ll give you my experience.

I bought that set and liked it but found that for me, I still wanted a stronger bridge pickup.

When I switched to a JB Jr. I felt that I lost the classic Strat middle/bridge tone though.

A SSL5 might have been a good choice...but I went with a Fralin SP43 for the bridge pickup.

That’s what I put in my buddy’s Jimmie Vaughan with a neck and middle SSL1.

In my own Strat I have two neck Surfers and a SP43.

But the SSL5 might have been a good choice as a bridge pickup too.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

It has been confirmed that it does, indeed, differ. I am not sure if the slight construction differences translate into a massive sonic difference, but it must have some sonic difference, or there would be no reason to make different ones.
I maintain that no one at SD HQ is trying to deceive anyone about what is in the SSL-1 set. If there are/were errors on the website, we do the best to correct them. We now have an answer..so, do they work for you? What music are you trying to create?

 

[PicoRiveraTele]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

I'm not going to beat around the bush: if two pickups wound with 42 awg have similar DC resistances to within 50 ohms, then one or the other is not "overwound" in any practical sense. The website has been corrected in that it no longer suggests that there is a meaningful difference between the bridge and neck models.

 

[gregory]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

the SSL5 might have been a good choice as a bridge pickup too.

I like the pickup in the bridge, but if you want traditional position 2 quack, the SSL5 is not a good choice.

For a true single that lies in between an SSL-1 and an SSL-5 from Duncan I'd look into the A5 Antiquity II Surfer Bridge or the A2 Antiquity Texas Hot Bridge.

 

[Chistopher]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

I'm not going to beat around the bush: if two pickups wound with 42 awg have similar DC resistances to within 50 ohms, then one or the other is not "overwound" in any practical sense. The website has been corrected in that it no longer suggests that there is a meaningful difference in DCR between the bridge and neck models. This doesn't mean that there aren't other differences, such as inductance, magnetic strength, or wind tension.

Corrected

 

[PicoRiveraTele]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

Corrected

It's in poor taste to misquote people like that.

If the DC resistance is that close for a given wire gauge, then the inductance is also going to be that close.

The magnetic strength could be different, but they never claimed it was, and I guarantee you it is not.

The wind tension could vary, but there again, they specifically said "overwound", not "wound more tightly", and even still, it wouldn't cause enough of a variance in the electrical properties of the pickup to justify doing it on purpose.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

It’s known that different spools of 42 ga. wire can actually differ +/- either way.

Some slightly thicker and some slightly thinner.

This is getting into the area of trade secrets and I wouldn’t expect Duncan pickups to reveal a trade secret, but I suspect that the bridge SSL1 in the California set might be wound from a spool who’s wire is a thickness slightly different from what the neck model is wound from.

 

[PicoRiveraTele]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

It’s known that different spools of 42 ga. wire can actually differ +/- either way.

Some slightly thicker and some slightly thinner.

This is getting into the area of trade secrets and I wouldn’t expect Duncan pickups to reveal a trade secret, but I suspect that the bridge SSL1 in the California set might be wound from a spool who’s wire is a thickness slightly different from what the neck model is wound from.

No, there is no trade secret here. The pickups are simply not different. This is just silly.

 

[Jacew]

Re: Duncan SSL1, california set

So is there any labels/markings etc... to differentiate pickups sold as a set from individually sold pickups?