Is it worth upgrading?

[blueman335]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

if you're worried about cost... visit the GFS site and pick up a set of their greybacks or a set of their "professional" grade pickups.

If you're worried about cost, buy used American-made PU's, which cost the same as, or slightly more, than new Asian ones. Then you're not compromising.

 

[KeeperOS]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

I did this once and to a very extreme extent. I took a 300€ guitar and put 900€ worth of upgrades and extra tech work in her for a final total of 1200€ or so.

The reason I did this was because from the very first time I took her in my hands and played her I liked the way she felt (particularly the shape of the neck) so I bought her with the intention of upgrading everything from the start.
I for one didn't regret it as she's still one of my favorite guitars (I have a number 1 but no number 3, I have two number 2s and she's one of the two).

However I had played enough guitars by then and knew that I liked her at the core (neck+body) before going through with it.
Chances are I probably wouldn't do it again but that has more to do with me being pretty much content with my current stable so I would probably only go for a higher-end guitar that I'd like as is (except perhaps a pu swap).

 

[GHWelles]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

One of my best sounding guitars is an affinity strat body with a Warmoth korina neck and all new hardware.

 

[ItsaBass]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

It depends. If it's just a beater that you plan on playing for a while, not likely as one of your main guitars, then I would not. However, if it is a guitar that you really get along with, and you plan on playing it for a long time as one of your main axes, then I say dump as much money into as you feel you need to to get it "up to speed."

The most "illogical" upgrades I've made are putting a total of about $900 into my Mexican Strat ($450 new), and a total of just under $600 into my Squier short scale Jaguar bass ($185 new). The MIM, I bought as a "bedside" guitar. I played it bone stock for seven years, only changing the strings once or twice in that time. Earlier this year, I modified it to make it into a quality gigging guitar. The Squier, I bought planning to modify, because it was a rare combination of features. (I am a lover of short-necked basses.)

I don't regret the mods one bit...however, if the day ever comes when these guitars must be sold, I have everything I need to return them to stock condition. Selling with the mods in place is what really wastes money. The best way to sell is to sell stock. Then you can use the aftermarket parts on future projects, or sell them separately to recover a larger percentage of your investment.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

if the day ever comes when these guitars must be sold, I have everything I need to return them to stock condition. Selling with the mods in place is what really wastes money. The best way to sell is to sell stock. Then you can use the aftermarket parts on future projects, or sell them separately to recover a larger percentage of your investment.

+1. This is the only way to do upgrades. In spite of any heartfelt proclamations to the contrary, everything gets sold eventually, and when you put $900 of upgrades into a $300 guitar, to the vast majority of potential buyers, it's still a $300 guitar.

 

[Empty Pockets]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

i only do this with guitars that i get laughable deals on.

like i got a Maestro Singlecut...bolt-neck Les Paul Junior-type ride... for $20. That's just funny y'know? I am gona heat-gun the poly off of it and put a nice Tele bridge pickup in it since I don't have a Tele right now... but I don't expect it to be a "serious" or "main" guitar.

 

[MasterKtulu]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

I did it four years ago as my first project guitar... I still own it and I never regretted doing it. I bought the Squire Affinity new for 200$ and changed everything except the body and the neck, putting around 300$ of upgrades on it.

It plays great, sounds great, fun to play and is great for what it is but it's still not an awesome high end guitar. I can never sell it, I would loose to much on it. I can't imagine getting more than 150$ for it, so I would rather keep it, even if I stopped playing it for some reason. Here's a before and after pics...

Before...

After...

 

[blueman335]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

I did it four years ago as my first project guitar... I still own it and I never regretted doing it. I bought the Squire Affinity new for 200$ and changed everything except the body and the neck, putting around 300$ of upgrades on it.

It plays great, sounds great, fun to play and is great for what it is but it's still not an awesome high end guitar. I can never sell it, I would loose to much on it. I can't imagine getting more than 150$ for it, so I would rather keep it, even if I stopped playing it for some reason.

Just keep the original (cheap) parts tucked away somewhere, so if you later change your mind and decide to sell the guitar you can put them back on. Gives you an option you just may want down the road. Plus in that case, you can either use the upgraded (expensive) parts on another guitar, or sell them and at least get something for them. Upgrading is a good idea; disposing of the old parts isn't.

 

[rumblebox]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

I've made some pretty great looking/sounding/playing turds in my day.

Same here. I've even taken a $20 set of MIM singles and swapped out the ceramic bar magnets for alnico 5 rod magnets.

A set of GFS pickups would be easier though.

 

[phil_104]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

Re-reading this thread though, wouldn't you just be better of scoring a used MIM strat? I mean, by the time you factor in the cost of upgrades, you are there, and you might even have a little wiggle room for a few add ons. No?

 

[Zerberus]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

For me, as soon as the price of upgrades meets or exceeds 25% of the instrument´s retail price it´s a dog and needs to get out of my house.

I`ve built and upgraded hundreds if not thousands of instruments over the past 20 years, and the only ones that came out to my satisfaction were instrumets that were either expensive to begin with or cheap planks that the Little Luthierie Fairies happened to bless one night in a drunken stupor.

If the wood is good, and I mean GOOD, then upgrades can make the guitar a keeper. IIRC Affinities are plywood (or at least used to be), so it does not even remotely qualify if that´s the case. Plywood guitars are good for exactly one thing: Luthierie practice.

 

[RorySquier]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

Affinities can be turned into professional quality instruments. The sky is the limit with these guitars.:eyecrazy:

 

[Rokkbert]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

Affinities can be turned into professional quality instruments. The sky is the limit with these guitars.:eyecrazy:

how true!

 

[blueman335]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

For me, as soon as the price of upgrades meets or exceeds 25% of the instrument´s retail price it´s a dog and needs to get out of my house.

That's a good idea, to set a limit on what you'll put into a guitar. If it takes more than that, you're usually better off buying a better guitar as a starting point and upgrading that one instead. There are a lot of great deals out there these days; find a good used guitar cheap and make it better.

 

[Zerberus]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

That's a good idea, to set a limit on what you'll put into a guitar. If it takes more than that, you're usually better off buying a better guitar as a starting point and upgrading that one instead. There are a lot of great deals out there these days; find a good used guitar cheap and make it better.

I feel that 25% across the board is a sensible cutoff. Even on a 200$ guitar that leaves me room to swap a pickup or replace tuners if she`s acoustically awesome, and if for some mysterious, unfathomable reason a high-end axe should fall into my hands with specs I don´t find ideal I have leeway to change that as well

 

[drpietrzak]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

This is a question that has more to do with - is it worth it to you? You will not "get your money back" but if you like how it plays it is not a big deal if the money is not a big deal.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

This is a question that has more to do with - is it worth it to you? You will not "get your money back" but if you like how it plays it is not a big deal if the money is not a big deal.

To put as much into upgrades as the guitar is worth, or more, is what's questionable. Why not spend that money on a better guitar in the first place? If you're going to end up putting $800 into a guitar, everything totalled, it makes more sense to put $100 into a $700 guitar, than to put $700 into a $100 guitar. In both cases the cost is the same. That's the point Zerb was making. Have a cut-off point so a guitar doesn't become a bottomless pit you throw money into. If you can afford hundreds of dollars of upgrades, you have the money to buy a better 'foundation' to start with. You're not saving anything by getting a cheapo guitar and then having to take out a loan to get everything replaced. With most imports, you can safely assume that the PU's have to go. That'll make the biggest improvement in tone, and you can often get those used for around half price. After that, think long and hard about replacing the hardware, as you can sink hundreds into it for a small improvement in tone. If the electronics work, there's no need to replace the wiring harness. If you want better hardware and electronics in a guitar, look for a deal on a higher quality one, which will have that and better wood. And won't cost you any more than an upgraded cheapo. Getting a deal on a used Epi and upgrading PU's makes sense; Buying an Epi and spending so much on upgrades that you could have gotten a Gibson is what we're trying to talk people out of. That is not 'worth it' to anyone. If you have the money to spend, spend it upfront, not after the original purchase.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

See - the thing about discussing this with the "Return On Investment" guys is that they never really get it. They are Return on investment guys, that's why they don't get it.

To some people, everything is worth its value in money and nothing more. But this is under the assumption that money is the most important feature.

I roll that way sometimes, but usually not. I have cheap @$$ guitars that are exactly that. They were bought because of some fun factor, some cool aspect, for the ability to learn to upgrade, or whatever sentimental reason. The fact that I may put $500 of parts into a buck fifty guitar has absolutely NOTHING to do with resale. It has to do with 'I wonder what this will do? I wonder if I can do this? Hey wouldn't this be cool/neat bad@$$"

The trap people get into is they put $500 into a buck fifty axe and then think that means it is a $650 guitar. That will almost always equal fail. In fact, most modded guitars equal fail because they are YOUR mods. I want something else. Could be as simple as 250 v 500k pots. If you know mods, you have preferences,. They are likely not anyone but yours.

Blueman makes a great case (and Zerb). They are not quite correct though - yes, it is EXTREMELY unlikely that the upgrades are worth it to anyone ELSE. But if they are worth it to YOU - rock on.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

Blueman makes a great case (and Zerb). They are not quite correct though - yes, it is EXTREMELY unlikely that the upgrades are worth it to anyone ELSE. But if they are worth it to YOU - rock on.

But why not put that money in a higher quality guitar to begin with? The return-on-investment thing is very real; everything gets sold. Eventually your tastes change, you find something else you like better, don't have as much time to play, or quit playing, etc. That's when dumping $500 into a $150 guitar becomes painfully apparent, when you realize what a blunder it was, and that $500 could gone for a lot of other things you wish you had instead (including non-musical expenditures). If you have loads of disposable income, $500 frittered away is no big deal. But if you have loads of disposable cash, you wouldn't be buying $150 entry-level guitars in the first place. It's the guys that don't have money to burn that make big upgrades on cheap guitars. They're proud of the 'deal' they got with the initial price, and don't know when to stop putting money into it. They get caught up in their $150 'deal.' For them, is it 'worth' spending $500 to make their $150 guitar better...no it isn't, or a $150 guitar wouldn't have appealed to them in the first place. Stop after upgrading PU's, and the thing makes sense. Accept a guitar's original price range for what it is (beginner, midprice, high end, etc) and don't think that you can bump it up to the next bracket. You can't. If you're going to end up spending the money that a high end would cost, then buy a high end, not a midprice. Same thing with trying make an entry level into a midprice, just buy a midprice. If you don't have the money to spend on a better guitar, ask yourself: do you have the money for lots of upgrades? Anyone can make a cheap guitar sound better, that's no scientific experiment, and certainly not worth pouring hundreds of dollars into to prove to yourself. It's like teenagers that get a cheap 4 cylinder slowpoke car, and then spend thousands of dollars on a spoiler, ground effects, big tires, graphics, etc. It's still a cheap slowpoke 4 cylinder, only now poeple laugh when you drive by. And they spent enough on upgrades that they could have bought a much sportier, faster car.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Is it worth upgrading?

But why not put that money in a higher quality guitar to begin with?

See, here is your problem. The answer is easy; i don't want a higher quality instrument.

Now, you are going to read that, chew on it, be baffled, not understand, and say that it doesn't make sense. No, if a quality instrument and maximum performance for the $ is what I want (npte the explicit use of the pronoun "I" there).

You are trying to have an argument about what is most important to YOU. And you are attempting to project your values onto ME. I don't care about the money, or the quality.

THIS cost as much to mod as the guitar itself. In fact, the Blackout cost more than the whole thing all put together (but I paid $28 for the pup).

No guitar for the suggested retail "cost "of doing this, about $240 can give me what I chose to get out of this. Guitar was originally $70 as it was originally. And that was not a high ROI or resale value or quality playing guitar.