Looking for a stack

[Fender_Punk]

Re: Looking for a stack

Thanks for all the help so far. I think I have some explaining to do.

I wont ditch my 15W Fender for bedroom jamming, and after this summer my garage will be soundproofed so I'd be able to play the stack during the day without sirens at my door.

As for the image aspect, no it's not for that, I just love the soundsd of stacks and they're great for gigging. I've helped bands roadie so i know what it feels like to lug those f*cking things up two flights of stairs, and I'd still get one cause it's worth it to me.

As for overkill, nah. Yes, it's a HUGE leap, but I've seen both those amps at venues such as Warped Tour and also at the Ford Plant (200-350 person venue) and Js Place (500 person venue MAYBE 700 PACKED) and they weren't overkill for any venue. Hell, at Bottom's Up, a local bar, the guitarist from Saturday Night Heroes was playing a Mesa triple rec. through a Marshall cab and that place is again 150-250 person venue and it wasn't overkill. I want to be able to buy a stack now, and then not have to worry about buying a new for another 6 years.

Keep giving me imput, I have till the end of the summer to decide, and I'm open to more suggestions, just the JCM and Dual Rec. are the ones I've currently zero'd in on. Price limit is about $2,000 for both head and one cab, and I only will buy a tube head. Lastly, I have a DS-1 and I quite like it, not sure if I'd keep using it with my amp, but it's always there if I don't like the amp distortion.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Looking for a stack

Someone mentioned Tim Armstrong using a Dual Rectifier, the coincidence is that Lars (other guitarist uses a JCM900). Those two tones are pretty complimentary. However, if you consider that the 3 major 'punk revival' albums of the 90's (Dookie, Smash, ...and out Come the Wolves) were recorded with a modded JCM800, you may want to consider one of those as well. The JCM900 is a staple in the punk and sk scene though.

Are you serious about funding a Mesa? A Mesa Halfstack is damn expensive. If so, check out the Stilleto series, it's an EL34 Marshall based amp with some of the Mesa response. Also, you can switch it back to 50W as well. (Can the Dual Recto power down to 50W?) Although playing spanky ska based punk the higher headroom from 100W may be better for you. 100W and 50W with the Mesas translates more to headroom and transient attack than volume.

Since you're not buying until the end of summer, you need to try out as many amps as possible. Also, consider a 2x12 or two 2x12's for the heft factor.

 

[Fender_Punk]

Re: Looking for a stack

Haha, what a coincedance. Another Punk group to use Mesa's is NOFX. Hefe slings a Tele and plays it through a Mesa Mk 4. My tone that I like is really kind of my own, I like a lot of the tones East Bay Ray (the hypocritcal swine that he is) got with his Tele. Johnny Ramone's tone is too buzzsaw for me to want to have as my own (though i do love hearing Ramones live albums).

When I play punk, I can go anywhere with distortion tastes. Depending on what I play, I use different pups and/or pup combinations on my Strat or Tele. Ramones, DK, NOFX, Bad Religion, Anti-Flag, The Clash (Strummer, not Jones) and Misfits are some punk bands with a good distortion for my taste. I know that's really varied, but I like my guitars bright and my distortion smooth and a little deep (think slightly below half way up on the tone of a DS-1).

I really like some of the JCM and Plexi tones, but then again I like the clean tones of Fender, Vox and Mesa amps more than clean Marshalls. I don't want any modeling, cause it will most likely be SS. I want to go all tube and I wont consider any cab less than a 4x12 simply because of the presence, thump and projection they can give.

If any of you still think I'm right in narrowing down to a Mesa rectifier or a JCM, post saying so. If you know of another tube amp head that cn capture what I want in a head (CELTIC?!?!?!?!?!?!), suggest it!! I forget who it is on here that makes the Celtics but they look beautiful and I'm seeing nothing but good reviews, maybe a custom Celtic 100W all tube head?

Thanks for bearing with me and for all the advice. Never knew someone would know so much about punk and ska with a name like PFD Darkside!!

EDIT!!: Scott_F makes thm, how could I forget. Scotty, what would charge for what I'm looking for??

 

[Fender_Punk]

Re: Looking for a stack

Oh, should probably mention, when I play Ska (which I do on my Tele) I like it bright, like Leftover Crack, Clash, Ill Scarlett, Concrete Jungle (by The Specials) to name a few examples. I do like listening to the more deep, less treble ska guitar tones, but I don't usually play them like that. So when thinking of ska guitar, think of the bright tones, not the deeper, more keyboard like ones.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Looking for a stack

Thanks for bearing with me and for all the advice. Never knew someone would know so much about punk and ska with a name like PFD Darkside!!

EDIT!!: Scott_F makes thm, how could I forget. Scotty, what would charge for what I'm looking for??

Hey man, I celebrate all music. (And I played in a popish punk band for 3 years in college. ) I love Bad Religion, NOFX, Rancid, Social D, The Misfits and Dead Kennedys.

You know, I bet a good bunch of tones you are listing were made with a Marshall JMP or JCM800 type amp just cranked up. Seriously, try out a Master Volume JMP or 800 with a boost or good OD in front of it. Also, I've always thought of Marshall crunch as more raw and Mesa distortion as more smooth and defined. Difficult to describe though.

I'm 90% sure that Scott's Marshall-ish amp in not Master Volume. You'll need to boost it and crank it to get the tones you're looking for I think. He does make some outstanding amps though, I'd love a Franklin and an Edana.

 

[Pink Unicorn Horsey]

Re: Looking for a stack

I have a Mesa 2x12 rectifier cab loaded with Celestion Vintage 30s. Actually, I have two of them, which is one two many for me, so I'm about to put one of them on the market. Let me know if you're interested. It would work well with any of the heads you've mentioned already.

- Keith

 

[Stratovarious]

Re: Looking for a stack

id get the JCM 900

I havent played one, but ive played a dual rectumfrier,

I just didnt like it

 

[Fender_Punk]

Re: Looking for a stack

Okay, so now I've pretty much eliminated Marshall from the list, unless there's a 100W tube head with a half power switch. One of the things I like about Mesa is I can get a 100W head with a 50/100 switch so I can heat up the tubes without over-powering/drowning out everyone else. I haven't talked to Scott yet, but i'm definately considering have him build me a custom Celtic, as his stuff looks beautiful and he's very flexible in what he can do and everyone says they're great!!!

Scott_F, expect an e-mail from me soon. As for cabinets, I'll either pick up a Mesa stiletto 4x12, a used Marshall 4x12, or a 2x12 Marshall and a 2x12 Mesa!! Or maybe a Mesa and Vox cab (both 2x12). But in the end I want 4 12s, and I really like that Mesa cabs have V30s!!

 

[Pink Unicorn Horsey]

Re: Looking for a stack

I haven't talked to Scott yet, but i'm definately considering have him build me a custom Celtic, as his stuff looks beautiful and he's very flexible in what he can do and everyone says they're great!!!

I'll let him speak for himself, but I just want to give you fair warning that I don't think Scott's doing much in the way of custom stuff anymore. However, I could be wrong.

- Keith

 

[Empty Pockets]

Re: Looking for a stack

Oh, should probably mention, when I play Ska (which I do on my Tele) I like it bright, like Leftover Crack, Clash, Ill Scarlett, Concrete Jungle (by The Specials) to name a few examples. I do like listening to the more deep, less treble ska guitar tones, but I don't usually play them like that. So when thinking of ska guitar, think of the bright tones, not the deeper, more keyboard like ones.

The guitarist for Leftover Crack uses a Peavey Butcher head and a DS-1 and for distortion, and gets a tone not unlike the roar of the 666th demon you fight on the way to hell...and that's a good tone in my opinion. You can find those heads on the Bay or on craigslist for like $200. Somebody was selling the head and matching 4x12 in my city a few months ago for around $300....True punks find great bargains.

-X

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Looking for a stack

True punks find great bargains.

-X

Yeah, true punks use whatever they can find/afford. A new Mesa stack isn't exactly punk.

 

[ImmortalSix]

Re: Looking for a stack

I don't see the "advantage" of a combo for most applications I've done- a 60 pound combo or a 50 lb cab with a 30 lb head carried in 2 loads. Cabs have casters... It can be a bit of a bear going up stairs, but it's nothing compared to a 92 lb 4x10 bass cab. Guitar player in my band has a VibroKing. No way in hell am I carrying that amp anywhere.

My back is cooked. I would absolutely love to find a 2x12 that sounds, feels and responds like a 4x12. I've played a lot of cabs. None of which come close. You're not going to find an open backed combo or a 2x12 cab that sounds, feels and responds like a 4x12. Conversely, you're not going to get an open backed combo sound out of a sealed 4x12.

I've heard some great things from musicians I trust about the Genz-Benz G-Flex cabinet...

 

[Rushfan2112]

Re: Looking for a stack

I'm pretty sure East Bay Ray found whatever Fender amp he could find and just cranked it... which is exactly what I would do. Especially if you want bright ska. I don't think many come in head/cab formats, though...

 

[Buckeyedog]

Re: Looking for a stack

You can buy a Peavey Windsor half stack for like $750. Check it out.

 

[Fender_Punk]

Re: Looking for a stack

I'm not really looking at Peavey's, they rub me the wrong way. Even when I saw/heard them as a kid they did. So I'm trying to stay away from those.

As for bargains, I'm definately looking on flea bay for used Mesas (preferably Nomads and rectifiers). I'd definately buy a stack used before new as it's lighter on my pocket, however I will dish out the bigger bills if means I get the tone I want.

As for Mesas not being Punk; Rancid, NOFX, Saturday Night Heroes, Angry Agency, I think the Flatliners, hell even Anti-Flag probably uses them. They can dish out punk, and have, they have great balls!! Besides, even if not one punk band used a Mesa I still would, cause I like how they sound for punk, so f*ck what every other punk uses! As for bright ska tones, I can get some bright ska tones out of the Mesa, turn up the treble on the amp, crank the TBX in full treble (bass reduction) and set it to the bridge and go!! I also have some realy good out-of-phase parallel wiring settings on my Strat that'll do the trick for some skanking tunes!!

Thanks for all the imput so far and keep it coming. I wonder if Scott has seen this thread yet and if he'd have any ideas for a head for me.

 

[ImmortalSix]

Re: Looking for a stack

If you didn't like Peavey when you were a kid, give them another look.

I didn't like Peavey when I was kid either, but recently I've found a lot of good stuff in their product line. (Classic 30, Delta Blues)

They are not who you think they are.

The Windsor head is worth looking at.

I am looking at Fender for my next amp purchase, the Peaveys were not for me, but as a fairly objective consumer, I have to say, look deeper into Peavey.

-Hunter

 

[J Moose]

Re: Looking for a stack

I think you should stop pondering & pontificating and actually get off 'yer duff and PLAY some amps.


That's the only way 'yer gonna figure out what's realistic & might work for YOU.


Still, a 100 watt head & 4x12 is just too damn big & loud to get it anywhere past about 3 on the dial unless your playing rooms that hold 500+ people.

I also don't think that Scott would be able to build you a Celtic head that would work for 'ya...

None of those amps have any real front-end gain. You'd have to crank the snot out of 'em to get some grind happening which brings 'ya back to "it's too damn loud".

 

[Fender_Punk]

Re: Looking for a stack

If you didn't like Peavey when you were a kid, give them another look.

I didn't like Peavey when I was kid either, but recently I've found a lot of good stuff in their product line. (Classic 30, Delta Blues)

They are not who you think they are.

The Windsor head is worth looking at.

...the Peaveys were not for me, but as a fairly objective consumer, I have to say, look deeper into Peavey.

-Hunter

As said I haven't liked them since I was a kid, and still don't. I tried a couple last summer, and heard some bands that used them, and I wanted to puke, and then roundhouse kick them Chuck Norris style for making such a stupid purchase.I didn't though because they seemed happyand the pit was going, i got my rage out in there.

Still, a 100 watt head & 4x12 is just too damn big & loud to get it anywhere past about 3 on the dial unless your playing rooms that hold 500+ people.

I also don't think that Scott would be able to build you a Celtic head that would work for 'ya...

None of those amps have any real front-end gain. You'd have to crank the snot out of 'em to get some grind happening which brings 'ya back to "it's too damn loud".

Too damn loud is what I keep hearing, but I'm AGAIN reminding everyone I'm looking for a head with a 50/100W switch so I can crank it up when needed. Also I'll have a sound proof room to play guitar, and my drums, so too damn loud isn't an issue unless your too damn old. As for front end gain, an English Mff'n or even my DS-1 could possibly resolve that issue, but it certainly isn't one with a Mesa!

Keep the opinions, suggestions flowing!

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Looking for a stack

I'm looking for a head with a 50/100W switch so I can crank it up when needed.

Here's a little trivia for you. How much louder is a 100W amp than a 50W amp?

 

[Rushfan2112]

Re: Looking for a stack

Here's a little trivia for you. How much louder is a 100W amp than a 50W amp?

Oooh! Oooh! I know!














3 db!

Trust us, please, 50w is friggin' loud. Every club you're going to be playing is going to have a mic, so you could use a 5w amp if you wanted and still get good tones. I don't think you truely need a 4x12+head, but if you are really hell bent on it, don't make it 100w. You'll never really hit the power tubes hard. And going down to 50w won't do you much help.