Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
- Thread starter Artie
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JB_From_Hell
Jomo's Nimions
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
I’ve heard DiMarzio’s brass bases are neutral.
I’ve heard DiMarzio’s brass bases are neutral.
idsnowdog
Imperator of Indignation
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Each metal has different tones. Even though they may not be magnetic they are conductive and do shape the tone of the pickup. Nickle steel baseplates give strong sharp highs, slightly scooped mids and percussive bass. Brass rounds off the highs, thickens the midrange and rounds off the bass (less percussive). I suspect that dimarzio uses short hex screws instead of long fillister screws so they can tune the effects of the brass baseplate and high resistance coils on the midrange and bass. I suspect a Super Distortion with fillister screws would be a midrange heavy mess. I have put a nickle steel baseplate on a Super Distortion and I have put a brass baseplate on a Entwhistle HDN. The difference wasn't night and day but it was audible.
Artie
Peaveyologist
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
That's kinda what I'm going for. Not so much higher volume. I just don't want to cut highs. This is for a neck pup project.
That's kinda what I'm going for. Not so much higher volume. I just don't want to cut highs. This is for a neck pup project.
ItsaBass
New member
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
There is no audible effect. Look for posts on the issue by the user Antigua Tele on TDPRI. He knows what he is talking about, and he has tested and disproved many these long-standings husband's tales about pickups – most notably the metal baseplate one.
Tele pickups, for the most part, sound differently than Strat pickups because they are wound quite a lot differently...and because they are in Teles, which tend to resonate a bit differently than Strats. The bottom plate isn't the reason.
There is no audible effect. Look for posts on the issue by the user Antigua Tele on TDPRI. He knows what he is talking about, and he has tested and disproved many these long-standings husband's tales about pickups – most notably the metal baseplate one.
Tele pickups, for the most part, sound differently than Strat pickups because they are wound quite a lot differently...and because they are in Teles, which tend to resonate a bit differently than Strats. The bottom plate isn't the reason.
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DavidRavenMoon
New member
Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Steel plates increase the inductance of the pickup. That fattens up the tone and the eddy current loss dulls the top end a bit. Just what you want in a Tele bridge pickup.
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Steel plates increase the inductance of the pickup. That fattens up the tone and the eddy current loss dulls the top end a bit. Just what you want in a Tele bridge pickup.
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DavidRavenMoon
New member
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Only if it’s magnetic stainless. Otherwise it won’t affect the pickup.
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Only if it’s magnetic stainless. Otherwise it won’t affect the pickup.
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Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Isn't plating just so it doesn't corrode?
Or is a non-magnetic plating over a magnetic material the baseplate version of Dimarzio's "Air" idea?
Isn't plating just so it doesn't corrode?
Or is a non-magnetic plating over a magnetic material the baseplate version of Dimarzio's "Air" idea?
freefrog
Well-known member
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Late to the party...
+ 1 about steel plates increasing Foucault currents a.k.a. Eddy currents but also inductance. That’s why some BP’s are sold and/or described as “inductance plates”, after all.
Now, another effect can be seen in the FEMM simulations published by a winder a long time ago:
http://www.skguitar.com/SKGS/sk/Images/pickups/Pickup stuff/Magnetics.htm
Humbucker BP’s are another question, already discussed in this forum a while back:
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/showthread.php?317404-Nickel-Silver-vs-Brass
FWIW.
Late to the party...
+ 1 about steel plates increasing Foucault currents a.k.a. Eddy currents but also inductance. That’s why some BP’s are sold and/or described as “inductance plates”, after all.
Now, another effect can be seen in the FEMM simulations published by a winder a long time ago:
http://www.skguitar.com/SKGS/sk/Images/pickups/Pickup stuff/Magnetics.htm
Humbucker BP’s are another question, already discussed in this forum a while back:
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/showthread.php?317404-Nickel-Silver-vs-Brass
FWIW.
idsnowdog
Imperator of Indignation
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Please don't try it yourself.
Artie
Peaveyologist
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Nice links. Dang, I miss frankfalbo. :bigok:
Maybe I should explain what my "project" is. I didn't want to say anything until I was finished, in case it failed miserably. But it might help, (to get me help), if people knew what I was doing.
Some of you may be aware of a couple of my posts where I talked about my big "George's Music blowout sale." One of the many items I scored, was this, for $20:
A good ole Ric Bass pup. You may notice that, except for the baseplate, it's identical to the CS El Diablo. I layed it and my Diablo side by side, and they do appear identical. But where the Diablo comes in at 22.1k w/A2's, the Ric is 8.6k with A5. My lil gray cells are asking me if this might make a cool El Diablo "neck" pup. The problem with the Ric pup is the weird baseplate. I'm not sure what that material is, but it almost looks like pressed cardboard. It appears to be paper based. (I emailed SD to ask what it is, but haven't received a response yet.) That's where this thread question comes into play. I'm going to trim that down to normal HB'er size, but I'd also like to reinforce it with metal. But I want to minimize any tonal aberrations. For all I know, that Ric pup may already be wound "bright" to give the bass more "snap". I just don't know what a Ric bass sounds like.
So, that's what I'm doing, and that's what my concerns are. Feel free to guide me in the right direction with thoughts, concerns, and other ideas.
Artie
Nice links. Dang, I miss frankfalbo. :bigok:
Maybe I should explain what my "project" is. I didn't want to say anything until I was finished, in case it failed miserably. But it might help, (to get me help), if people knew what I was doing.
Some of you may be aware of a couple of my posts where I talked about my big "George's Music blowout sale." One of the many items I scored, was this, for $20:
A good ole Ric Bass pup. You may notice that, except for the baseplate, it's identical to the CS El Diablo. I layed it and my Diablo side by side, and they do appear identical. But where the Diablo comes in at 22.1k w/A2's, the Ric is 8.6k with A5. My lil gray cells are asking me if this might make a cool El Diablo "neck" pup. The problem with the Ric pup is the weird baseplate. I'm not sure what that material is, but it almost looks like pressed cardboard. It appears to be paper based. (I emailed SD to ask what it is, but haven't received a response yet.) That's where this thread question comes into play. I'm going to trim that down to normal HB'er size, but I'd also like to reinforce it with metal. But I want to minimize any tonal aberrations. For all I know, that Ric pup may already be wound "bright" to give the bass more "snap". I just don't know what a Ric bass sounds like.
So, that's what I'm doing, and that's what my concerns are. Feel free to guide me in the right direction with thoughts, concerns, and other ideas.
Artie
freefrog
Well-known member
Re: Remind me: what does the copper plated steel bottom plate do for some pickups?
Ah, OK!
Artie,
Two metallic fasteners on the sides of the trimmed baseplate would be my choice (for what I imagine as an easier operation than changing the baseplate but I might be wrong). Have you considered Tinnerman clips? It looks cheap but it's a good way to hold pickups height screws IME. Unless you find some screwable eyelets like those used in EMG's?
Anyway and to be honest, the only real detrimental tonal effect I've ever noticed with a modified baseplate was due to thick big chunks of aluminium, screwed below in place of the original feet. It was probably due to an incredible amount of Eddy currents, themselves due to the thickness of the aluminium used... I don't think that two small bits on the sides would harm...
FWIW.
Ah, OK!
Artie,
Two metallic fasteners on the sides of the trimmed baseplate would be my choice (for what I imagine as an easier operation than changing the baseplate but I might be wrong). Have you considered Tinnerman clips? It looks cheap but it's a good way to hold pickups height screws IME. Unless you find some screwable eyelets like those used in EMG's?
Anyway and to be honest, the only real detrimental tonal effect I've ever noticed with a modified baseplate was due to thick big chunks of aluminium, screwed below in place of the original feet. It was probably due to an incredible amount of Eddy currents, themselves due to the thickness of the aluminium used... I don't think that two small bits on the sides would harm...
FWIW.
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