Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Pierre

Stratologist
Apparently it's more readily available in Europe as most other tonewoods, and seems to be cheaper too. From what I understand, it sounds a little similar to Mahogany, maybe a little less pronounced. Could some of the Luthier, especially the eurotechs tell me more about it please? Why is it not used me for instance..?
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Can't give much by way of tonal properties bro, but I heard a guy jamming on a walnut tele the other day through an old marshall superlead that a local shop accquired. I don't know wether it was the amp, guitar, player, or a culmination of the 3. But it was like almost heavenly.

The guy wouldn't tell me what kind of pickups were in it, but they were of the rail family. Not sure whose though.....
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

One of my favorite guitars I ever made was a Walnut strat with a Walnut/Ebony neck, and a Bartolini System 111B. I started making it for myself, and then I recieved an offer I could not refuse. Later the guy swapped it at a GC and it was talked about for years to come by those salesmen too. Man what a great guitar that was.

There's a word that gets tossed around here that drives me crazy because it's so ambiguous, and sometimes I think it's just one of those "ego words". The word is "complex". Walnut has a very complex midrange, but I'm going to break it down for you even further. I wrote a detailed woods description for another site that's been reproduced in a couple other areas. Here is one place that still has it up:

http://www.dinosaurrockguitar.com/tonewoods.shtml

What Walnut does is to comb away (notch) some midrange frequencies while still having a good, highly present midrange. A huge oversimplification of "combing" would be to go to a 31 band EQ and raise every other fader all the way up, and lower every other fader all the way down. A notch filter takes designated frequencies and eliminates them without affecting the surrounding frequencies, like some feedback filters. So that's how I describe Walnut. It is a great guitar wood. It has a sharper attack than Mahogany because it's harder. It resonates a little like Ash so it's sweet sounding in the midrange, assuming you get a lighter piece. Since it's not as hard or dense as Maple, it still represents the low frequencies well, too. I love it with Ebony and Pao Ferro boards.

It also does great with trems, hard tails, string through, floyds, etc. It really combines with other neck woods well, and various bridges. In that article, I say that it is more sensitive to pickup choices, in that it will impart it's tonal footprint over whatever pickups you put in there. That doesn't mean all the pickups will sound the same. On the contrary. You'll get your wide variance among pickups. But some pickups that usually sound great in most guitars can sound lousy in the Walnut if there's a conflict with some of the main resonant frequencies of the wood. Like my experience is that a JB in a Walnut strat would be lousy. It would sound cheap. But any of the Customs would be great. A lower output vintage tele bridge pickup would probably be less than magical too, while a robust, "power tele" bridge pickup would be fantastic.

It's probably not used in guitars very often because it's generally heavier. So a factory isn't going to go through several pieces to find a lighter one with open pores. But a luthier sure could. That's probably why you tend to see it more often in boutique hand made guitar lines. But if I were a factory, I would use it abundantly as backs in hollowed out guitars like thinlines, and those Schecter-style hollow super strats. It's a great hollow back wood, and then it doesn't matter if you have a heavy piece. Sorry for the rant, but I am a champion of Walnut, and I further it's cause whenever I can. :bigok: :fest7:
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

I don't like the tone of walnut in a solid body guitar. I think it tends to sound one dimensional and plinky.

IMO, it lacks complexity.

Only person I've heard use a walnut guitar who's playing I loved was Albert King...he played that Dan Erlewine Flying V.

But it's the gunner...not the gun. That's what Buddy Whittington told me at the Dallas Guitar Show on Sunday. And Albert was quite the gunner!

Dan made three guitars out of that same piece of walnut.

He also made a Les Paul for a friend of mine and a Strat for Otis Rush.

I watched Dan making those guitars and knew the owner of the Les Paul well. It was a lousy sounding guitar...as was the Strat.

In fact, Otis Rush didn't like the Strat and I don't think he ever played it after trying it out when Dan was done with it.

Walnut is not an especially good tone wood IMO...at least it never appealed to me.

I don't have alot of experieince with walnut but I did not like playing any of those three guitars.

Lew
 
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Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

The '77 Kramer 450G I used to own had a walnut and maple body. It sounded really good with an aluminum neck.
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Lewguitar said:
IMO, it lacks complexity...I don't have alot of experieince with walnut but I did not like playing any of those three guitars.
Priceless.:rolleyes: They probably needed Brazillian Rosewood fretboards. :laugh2:

I will say it's no substitute for Mahogany, and if you want a traditional LP sound it will make a crappy Les Paul. But a bolt neck Strat/Tele is going to sound great if you have a lighter piece. A heavy piece might as well be Maple. I don't know what Dan had there, but that makes all the difference. If you're trying to duplicate vintage tones it's also a risky choice. If you really wanted Ash/Alder/Mahogany but can't get it where you live, Walnut isn't necessarily a substitute for any of those, although Pierre is on the right track with "like Mahogany but less pronounced" because of the greater compression in the mids. You have to design around Walnut. You have to choose your accompanyig woods accordingly, and as I said, pickups too. If you do that, you should have total success.
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

I once knew a baby blue Fender "The Strat" that had a walnut body & a maple/rosewood neck. That guitar was heavier then hell but sounded great IMO. Highly defined with a low-end chuck...a bit scooped sounding next to most American Std Strats but it sounded good & "right" to me & the guy that owned it. I always loved playing that thing, just couldn't play it standing for a long time!
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

frankfalbo said:
Priceless.:rolleyes: They probably needed Brazillian Rosewood fretboards. :laugh2:

I will say it's no substitute for Mahogany, and if you want a traditional LP sound it will make a crappy Les Paul. But a bolt neck Strat/Tele is going to sound great if you have a lighter piece. A heavy piece might as well be Maple. I don't know what Dan had there, but that makes all the difference. If you're trying to duplicate vintage tones it's also a risky choice. If you really wanted Ash/Alder/Mahogany but can't get it where you live, Walnut isn't necessarily a substitute for any of those, although Pierre is on the right track with "like Mahogany but less pronounced" because of the greater compression in the mids. You have to design around Walnut. You have to choose your accompanyig woods accordingly, and as I said, pickups too. If you do that, you should have total success.

Actually, since this was about 1972 or so, they probably did have Brazilian fingerboards. Didn't help. Those guitars had glued in necks...except for the Strat. I can't remember...maybe it had a glued in neck too...but I kinda doubt it. Sounded lousy regardless...no one I know who tried it liked it, especially the guy it was made for: Otis Rush.

Walnut's heavy and not especially resonant, but there probably are some guitars made from walnut that sound decent. None I've tried did though...

I don't like solid body maple body guitars either...never played one I liked.

I don't tend to like the tone of heavy solid body guitars...most experienced players don't.

I like guitars that are light and resonant...most experienced players do.

There's always exceptions though...maybe one day I'll play one that's an exception.

Lew
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Lew I thought The ALbert King Flying V that Dan made was Korina. I have Dan's Guitar repair book... But I could be wrong.
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Alright thanks everyone! I can see why it's not used as much now. Though Frank's talk about it sure made it seem attractive in a way...
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Just find a light piece. I mean, no Walnut is truly light weight like Swamp Ash or Alder, but when comparing it to other Walnut boards, find a light one. Unless you want a true vintage replica, it's a really cool body wood IMO, despite three Erlewines from 1972. And I concur with Lew that if you go out into the world and try 5 Walnut guitars, there's probably a good chance some will suck, because it's a heavy piece, or it's not matched with the right pickups, etc.

Maple is the same way. All those old Carvins, and other all Maple guitars usually sound like crap. But I have a Maple strat with a Rosewood neck/Ebony board, and another Maple guitar with an all Rosewood neck. A third with a Mahogany/Ebony neck, and they're fantastic. You wouldn't mistake the sound for a '63 strat or anything, but they're ultra responsive, and don't suffer from any of the typical Maple pitfalls. My most recent build is a solid one-piece quilted Maple 7-string. The Maple keeps the low B nice and tight, but the way I built/carved it maintains a strong low end presence, too.

I'm not saying these woods are the be-all/end-all by any means. All my other guitars are more traditional woods. If I could only have one Strat and one LP, I'd use the traditional wood combinations. Just don't count them out entirely. The custom bass builders have been on this trip for decades now. Sometimes you have to think outside the box, especially if you live in a country where traditional woods are harder to find or too expensive.
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

I generally think of Walnut (in a nutshell) as a slightly darker and more anemic maple.... not necessarily a bad thing, but I´ve never played or built a walnut guitar that had something "special".....

I think it really depends on the application... in a V I can imagine it sounding quite balanced, though numerous Norlin era Gibsons exist as proof of the contrary.... In a superstrat on the other hand I´d likely tend towards something else...
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

I only heard walnut once when meeting someone owning a Rickenbacker Lemmy bass. That bass sounded killer to me sounded somewhere in between maple and alder with a very nice and warm sound.
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Alright I see then. What other European cheaper substitute but perfectly toneful woods are there?
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Lake Placid Blues said:
Try Limewood. Common to northern Europe and very similar to basswood. Ofton used for piano sound boards.

:eek13:

I can´t think of 2 woods that are farther apart, both tonally and structurally...one is bright and percussive with a warm edge and is also structurally heavy and strong, the other one is warm but IMO "thin", but it´s light and you can tear a Floyd off like Toilet paper if you use wood studs instead of bushings.... Limewood is great for pianos, but is definitely not a walnut or Maple substitute in any way IMO...
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Yes, but both maple and walnut are not all that close to mahogony tonally, other than sustain, in my opinion. Limewood, may be warmer and more resonate tonally than walnut or maple.

Although it's running the risk of obtaining a potentially brittle tone, maple isn't all that bad, if done well, and if a more light weight stock is selected. After all, I have an all maple Charvel that belies many of the standard asumptions about maple's tone (it's very heavy though). With Maple the pickup selection seems to be crucial. Additionally, I would probably avoid a floyd with maple.
 
Re: Walnut as a solid body tonewood...

Intentional Bump


So, shopping about some "The Les Paul" models from 78/79. What would perhaps be a great all around hum bucker for one of these in the Duncan line?
 
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