Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

[Simon_F]

I'm thinking about replacing my Hot Plate with a Weber Mass - I don't like the big steps in attenuation that the Hot Plate has, and would prefer continuous adjustment.

I was thinking I'd go for the regular Mass...

https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/mass.htm

But while I was looking at the Weber site, I noticed the Mass Lite. The separate power level controls for bass/mids and upper mids/treble look very interesting :scratchch ...

https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/masslite.htm

Have any of you guys got experience of both these units? Any views on the Mass Lite?

Thanks.

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

I had a Mini mass and really liked it...shouldn't have sold it but at the time I wasn;t using it. FWIW, if you want smaller steps in the Hot Plate you can send it back to THD and they can mod it for 2db per "click" where you currently have 4...

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Can I add my n00b related question?

What about using a variac vs an attenuator, or is one better than the other?

 

[Mike M.]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

I have the Mass Lite 100 that I use with my DSL 50 and for MY needs I think it's a great unit. (I just play at home so for me it's fine). First off, when you are using a Weber attenuator and you go from Bypass to Active your signal is instantly attenuated. Even with both of the dials turned fully clock-wise your signal is cut by about 1/4. This may or may not be a good thing depending on your amp and it's power. I've read of folks who have a 30 watt amp who don't like that instant volume cut. So you may want to take that into consideration. But if you have a 50 or a 100 watt amp it may work very good for you.

For me, the two seperate dials for the Lows/Mids & Mids/Highs work very well with an amp like the DSL 50. That amp is loaded with treble. Too much if you ask me. So I can then use the dial for the Mids/Highs to calm down some of the excessive high end and can then fine tune it with the amps Presence, Treble and Mid controls.

Again, I just play at home so how this would work in a band setting is something that I can't answer. Hope this helped you a bit.

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Can I add my n00b related question?

What about using a variac vs an attenuator, or is one better than the other?

I won't say one is better or worse than the other but I will say this...a Variac loweres the voltage coming out of the wall and by doing so lowers ALL the voltages in the amp and that is known to cause problems with tube life and other things...IM not gonna say that there have never been any problems related to using an attenuator but I would think it's far easier and safer to simply get an attenuator.

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

I read about a variac possibly causing damage to the tubes, and some say true, while others say bunk, and they have used them for years...blah blah.

Anyway, I have no experience with them, and that is why I asked.

I just got a 100 watt Marshall, and I am going to have to tame it with something.

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

I read about a variac possibly causing damage to the tubes, and some say true, while others say bunk, and they have used them for years...blah blah.
Anyway, I have no experience with them, and that is why I asked.
I just got a 100 watt Marshall, and I am going to have to tame it with something.

I can tell you this...a variac causeing premature tube failure is NOT bunk, it does and will happen if you use a variac, some say it's worth it while other disagree. Also, I think you'll have a hard time taming a 100 watt anything for most settings with either a variac or an attenuator but if I could only pick one I'd got for the attenuator

 

[Simon_F]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

I have the Mass Lite 100 that I use with my DSL 50 and for MY needs I think it's a great unit. (I just play at home so for me it's fine). First off, when you are using a Weber attenuator and you go from Bypass to Active your signal is instantly attenuated. Even with both of the dials turned fully clock-wise your signal is cut by about 1/4. This may or may not be a good thing depending on your amp and it's power. I've read of folks who have a 30 watt amp who don't like that instant volume cut. So you may want to take that into consideration. But if you have a 50 or a 100 watt amp it may work very good for you.

For me, the two seperate dials for the Lows/Mids & Mids/Highs work very well with an amp like the DSL 50. That amp is loaded with treble. Too much if you ask me. So I can then use the dial for the Mids/Highs to calm down some of the excessive high end and can then fine tune it with the amps Presence, Treble and Mid controls.

Again, I just play at home so how this would work in a band setting is something that I can't answer. Hope this helped you a bit.

Thanks Mike. This is very helpful.

The amp I use an attenuator with is my '77 Marshall JMP 2204 - 50w master volume head. I like to run the amp with master and pre-amp volumes both around 5 or 6 for some nice blues & classic rock crunch. I use the attenuator to keep it at small gig friendly volume - it's the loudest 50 watt amp I've ever heard!

Gigging with the Hot Plate I often find -4dB is too loud and -8dB is too quiet, plus I like to edge the volume up a little as the night wears on. I just get frustrated with those big steps on the Hot Plate.

I wonder what's lite about the Mass Lite? I guess it doesn't have the tone stack on the line out, but I never use the line out on my Hot Plate anyway and probably wouldn't on the Mass.

The JMP is a bassy amp, so having separate control over lows and highs quite appeals to me.

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Simon, other than the volume bumps, are you happy with the sound you get with a hotplate?

 

[Simon_F]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Yes, the Hot Plate tone is fine, though I don't use it to attenuate down to bedroom volume. I don't dime the amp either. I just like to get the power tubes sweating a bit, then limit the volume so it's appropriate to the venue.

The other thing (apart from the big steps) that bugs me with the Hot Plate is the different versions for different ohmages. I checked with THD and you can actually use a 16 ohm Hot Plate with an 8 ohm cab (provided you set your amp at 8 ohms too) - it's just that the Bright and Deep switches are tailored for the particular ohmage in question. I have 16 ohms and 8 ohms cabs - it would be nice to have an attenuator that isn't tonally optimised for one or the other.

 

[Simon_F]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Hmm, the Harmony Central reviews of the Lite are split...

Two good (one of which I think is Mike's ), two bad.

 

[Rich_T]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Awesome,I was just about to start a thread about attenuators for my amp too. Being as we use the same rig, now I don't need to!

 

[Dr.Mavashi]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Harmony Central is like Access Holywood of guitar world ..... who cares ... I've listened to TGWIF and got a MassLite 100, couldnt be more happier, its not just a thing that makes your half stack playable at home. Its a tone tool, I turn my Laney up to 6 or 7 when I jam with friends in the garage and those who know AORs know that 6 or 7 lould enough for mid-size club. But then when I start playing with the pre-amp gain and the two knobs on thw webber mass I get so much vocabulary out of my amp its fantastic, just get it, it has a good re-sale value so you wont loose much if for some reason you dont like it. Just remember that if you crank up loud with a good amount of dirt you need double you wattage, i.e. 50 watt amp - 100 watt mass.

 

[Simon_F]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Awesome,I was just about to start a thread about attenuators for my amp too. Being as we use the same rig, now I don't need to!

The Hot Plate actually sounds pretty good with the JMP MV, but the big steps in attenuation are a pain in the bottom for gigging!

 

[Simon_F]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Harmony Central is like Access Holywood of guitar world ..... who cares ... I've listened to TGWIF and got a MassLite 100, couldnt be more happier, its not just a thing that makes your half stack playable at home. Its a tone tool, I turn my Laney up to 6 or 7 when I jam with friends in the garage and those who know AORs know that 6 or 7 lould enough for mid-size club. But then when I start playing with the pre-amp gain and the two knobs on thw webber mass I get so much vocabulary out of my amp its fantastic, just get it, it has a good re-sale value so you wont loose much if for some reason you dont like it. Just remember that if you crank up loud with a good amount of dirt you need double you wattage, i.e. 50 watt amp - 100 watt mass.

Thanks Dr. This is the kind of info I was looking for. I know how it is with HC.

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Simon, check this...

http://www.ultimateattenuator.com/home.html

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

FWIW, I tried the Ultimate Attenuator and the only thought I had was "why is this thing so expensive?"

It's just not worth it IMO...

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Weber Attenuators - Mass or Mass Lite?

Yeah, I priced it after I posted the link.

It would have to work twice as well for that money.