Wiring Diag Help Needed

THRobinson

THRobinson

New member
I have an old Hondo that has a SSH configuration. Each pickup has a mini toggle on/off, there is a mini toggle for coil split of the humbucker, plus vol/tone/tone.

Part of the harness was gone when I got it, and the previous owner decided it was easier to reip the leads off at the pickup rather than desolder at the pot.

I grabbed a set of new pickups, twin-rail humbucker, and twin-rail single coil sized humbuckers.

I was thinking, instead of the original setup, maybe replace the 2way minis with 3way for off/single/full for each pickup, vol/tone/tone, and replace the last mini toggle with a kill switch.

Anyone have that as a diagram or willing to help me figure it out? I can draw and follow diagrams but can't really design.
 
What exactly are your "twin-rail" singles? They don't all lend themselves for split / parallel modes.
 
I went cheap... ceramic FLEOR brand. I have a PBass Alnico and a Telecaster set of Alnico FLEORs and the build quality is actually very good. The HONDO cost me $40 with a hard shell case so, although a nice Alder body and locking trem, I wanted to stay cheap with this build.

These are the pickups... looks splittable.

s-l1600.jpg
 
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To get stuff started... I made a diagram for the original wiring (or as best as I could since a small part of the original harness was gone).

I removed the wiring, swapped the pickups to rails and swapped the one toggle with a kill switch.

Original harness has the caps on the pots, versus between pots. I'm fine either way, but rather keep the caps on the pots to keep it tidier and help with space.

If helps, I can move the pots to the right of the toggles.

EDIT - Removed Image
 
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Ok. One last quick question. Are those switches 2-position or 3-position? On-on-on or On-off-on?
 
No idea... that's why I am here, to figure out what would be needed. I know switches come in SPST, SPDT, DPDT, etc... but no clue which I need.

Original switches are 2-way toggles, on-off.

I was debating 3-way switches, so I could have a switch for each pickup, off-single-double (or off-split-full).

Not sure if that would be cool and handy, or more a pain in the arse than it's worth, but, lots of combos.

Other option maybe, have the three 2-way toggles as on-off for each pickup, and use push-pull pots and each pot is a split for each pickup. Problem I imagine with that is, although easier to use, the wiring would have a lot of back-forth inside I suspect.

I saw a diagram for 3 humbuckers with 3 mini switches for I think it was off-phase-out of phase for each. Close....

https://www.strat-talk.com/proxy.ph...CPq.jpg&hash=bf31bb16dd8d42706312d898c5494681

Also kinda cool for the in/out of phase but then lose any single-coil sounds, not that I expect these to have great single coil abilities anyways.

Basically, want as many combos as I can with all the switches and knobs it has. The kind of guitar you need a manual for. :D
 
You didn't mention if you have a pickup selector switch so I assume not.
Why do you have or need a second tone pot? Why do you show it wired differently than the first tone pot? (I personally would leave it out and have just master vol and master tone tone).

I can't give you a drawing, but I can tell you how to wire it.
Label your switches from left to right, top row then bottom row:
a1 - a2 - a3
b1 - b2 - b3

Assuming SD wire colors, connect each pup to its respective switch (DPDT, on/on/on)...
Connect a1 to ground,
Connect a2 to white,
Connect a3 to red,
Connect b1 to a1,
Connect b2 to black,
Connect b3 to left lug of vol pot
Connect middle lug of vol pot to input lug of kill switch.

Connect output of kill switch to input lug of output jack and to middle lug of tone pot.
Of course, ground all components.

This will give you "off" in switch position #1, split (to black & white coil) in #2, and full series humbucker in #3.
 
Nope... no toggle switch. What I have is in the first sentence of the OP....

Here's a photo of the same guitar (not mine).

It's kinda cool of a guitar but again, previous owner killed the pickups and the 3rd tone post was missing. Had to create what I could and had help for the rest.

Was going to buy similar pickups, but then decided on the dual-rails instead for something different. Realized hey, the singles can be split as well and well, here we are.

I'll draw something up and upload it, and see if it's on-track.

What kind of toggle do I need? This one?

LINK

ON/OFF/ON DPDT?
 
Many different types of switches could do what you want with different wiring schemes necessary. The ones I mentioned are DPDT on/on/on.
Again, what's with the second tone pot?
 
As mentioned a few times, diagram is based on what's in the original guitar... This guitar had something called TrickTone wiring? No idea what it means... All I know is that the guitar has a volume and two tones... Which isn't uncommon, but when I had help finishing the missing parts of the diagram, we questioned how it works or if.

I have a 2nd Hondo here, Warlock knockoff my nephew was gifted and needs repairs and refinished. 2 humbuckers vol/tone/tone and a 3way switch. Bit simpler and parts were all intact.

I'm not glued to the idea.

Could instead go with three 2way mini switches, single/humbucker. Vol/Tone, and a 5way selector potentiometer. Plus kill switch.

That might even be easier to use...?
 
Did you mean, "5 way blade selector switch" (like in a Strat)?
Click to expand...

Nope,. I mean an Oak Grigsby 5-Way/4Pole Rotary Pickup Selector.
https://reverb.com/ca/item/17784067-5-way-rotary-pickup-selector-switch

Do you have the switches in your possession? Do they "click" in two or three positions? That's kind of important to know.​
Click to expand...

Well, as stated before, the original was 3 x 2way on/off, an 1 x 2way splitter. Needs all new pots/switches anyways, original stuff old and corroded, very tiny pots, etc. I bought new pots and 2ways, but can buy other stuff if needed since I know what I have now will eventually get used.

That said... I think (having talked with my nephew who will likely get the guitar eventually anyway) that maybe my original idea of 3way switches isn't the way to go, especially if trying to switch positions during a song.

Instead... how about

3 x 2way splitters
1 vol
1 tone
1 kill switch
1 5way rotary switch

Unless we can think of something more useful for that kill switch hole. It's mini-toggle size... phase switch?

2:40am on Xmas, may give it the day to ponder. Meanwhile, I'll rearrange the diagram to the same layout as the guitar and label the leads and such.
 
THRobinson said:
Nope,. I mean an Oak Grigsby 5-Way/4Pole Rotary Pickup Selector.
https://reverb.com/ca/item/17784067-5-way-rotary-pickup-selector-switch.
Click to expand...


OK, rotary switch, still not a potentiometer. Rotary switches have their place, but they're not very practical for use as guitar switches...they're clumsy to use on the fly. That's why it's rare to see them on guitars, and even rarer to see them used as pickup selector switches (if EVER).



THRobinson said:
Well, as stated before, the original was 3 x 2way on/off, an 1 x 2way splitter. Needs all new pots/switches anyways, original stuff old and corroded, very tiny pots, etc. I bought new pots and 2ways, but can buy other stuff if needed since I know what I have now will eventually get used.

That said... I think (having talked with my nephew who will likely get the guitar eventually anyway) that maybe my original idea of 3way switches isn't the way to go, especially if trying to switch positions during a song.

Instead... how about

3 x 2way splitters
1 vol
1 tone
1 kill switch
1 5way rotary switch

Unless we can think of something more useful for that kill switch hole. It's mini-toggle size... phase switch?
Click to expand...


I see from your post #8 that it's an hss (not ssh as you said in your op). It's customary to list pups from bridge to neck.
I'm just trying to figure out what it is you want to accomplish with this guitar. Seems like you are too. I can't really help you if I don't know where we're going.
It's obvious that you are a newbe to guitars and guitar electronics which is ok...that's why we're here, to help. But it would be best if you had some general ideas of what you want to accomplish rather than some specific ideas that you've heard or read about but don't understand. There's nothing "wrong" with having a tricked out guitar. It can be kinda fun. But you've gotta know what you want. We can certainly guide you through this process but we need to be up front with each other if we're going to succeed. Just think about it for awhile and let us know WHAT you want the guitar to do, and we'll help help you to know HOW to get there and what components you'll need to do it.

We're glad to spend the time and effort to help you, but not if you have no clue as to what you want or if you keep changing you mind. Actually, changing your mind is ok if you have decided that you want something else that would work better for you but not because you just don't know what you want and you are just fishing.


THRobinson said:
Meanwhile, I'll rearrange the diagram to the same layout as the guitar and label the leads and such.
Click to expand...

Wait a sec. YOU are going to do the diagram? What is it that you want US to do?
I'm getting more and more confused.
 
HSS vs SSH... I often wondered which was the proper way since on eBay when I was searching for pickups it was listed both ways for the same configuration. I always said HSS but I think the listing for what I bought was SSH, though description said the full sized humbucker was indeed the bridge.

I've worked on guitars a few years but pickup wiring has always been straight forward and diagrams easily found.

As for what I want to accomplish. I mentioned this before a few times, the guitar already has the holes drilled, just as shown in the photo. Initially I planned to rewire it the same as original but since I bought dual-rails for all pickups, everything can be split offering more combos.

So, what I am trying to accomplish is to come up with a useful configuration that uses the existing holes.

Again, the guitar will be stained black, and a very thin poly finish on top. No grain filler or sealer. Just an open pore satin finish showing the grain so, plugging holes and painting over top not an option.

Diagram wise, I'd be placing the parts and labelling the connection points, no wiring, so someone can either print it out and draw on the wiring, or type out directions like run the red wire from 1A to 4D or whatever. Then I'd draw in the wiring.

Hopefully makes sense...

Basically, 4 small switch holes, 3 large pot holes, 1 jack hole. Plus 3 splittable humbuckers.

If anyone has better ideas, I'm open to them. Again, just wanna use the holes that exist and maximize options without making things too difficult to use.

Whatever it needs I can buy (within reason) because original parts need replaced anyways.
 
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Here's a suggestion (this is what I'd do if it were my guitar):

The three mini switches could be DPDT on/on/on for series/split/parallel for each pup.
The forth small hole for a SPST mini switch to add the middle pup to any toggle position.
Master Vol.
Master Tone.
The third larger hole toward the bottom of the guitar could be for a 3-way toggle switch (like on a Les Paul). This hole will need to be drilled out ,or filed, to 1/2" (or 12mm). Not a big deal.
Lastly, the output jack.

What this will do is give you:
Bridge,
Bridge + Neck,
Neck,
Bridge + Middle,
Bridge + Middle + Neck,
Neck + Middle,

Any of these pups can be independently selected to be series humbucker, split, or parallel humbucker.

If this sounds like what you would like to do, I could work up a diagram.
 
If you wanted to get even more creative you could use a push/pull pot for your tone control and wire it to put your bridge pup out of phase.
 
Side note... LINK... wow... I thought I was making things difficult with wiring, check that one out!

I was debating a 3-way in place of the 3rd tone, or one of those 5-way switches that look like a standard Les Paul 3-way, but about $65CAD for those. More than the guitar cost.

So, basically, the 3-way selector will be like a Les Paul and ignore the middle completely, and the 4th mini toggle would be a simple on/off for the middle? That could work.

Been busy the past 2 days with Xmas/Family, not really been at the computer.

I have 2way minis, A500K pots, and 0.047uF caps for it already, but mini switches are cheap so can grab 3 x 3-way DPDT on-on-on for it.

Not sure which tone to make into the large 3-way though... I think the far right one maybe,

ybfzui1koa6b0fejfr8l.png
 
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