Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

[FuseG4]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

I really tried liking the DSL/TSL line, but I found the gain channels to be buzzy unless the amp was cranked and the cleans to be sub-par at best. Got a Rivera, never looked back.

I can see that. the DSL, although designated to be the heir to the "JCM" line, it kinda isn't marshall "flagship" quality. The amp has quirks and flaws, and could use things like a choke, etc. I mean, it IS PCB.
It was priced near the bottom of the price range for Made in UK Marshalls, and I'll admit it shows a lil. It's the cheapest amp that has those features and sound and that's why I bought it.
Compared to some $1500+ amps, the DSL does start to lose it's appeal, but I feel like this amp beats almost any "british EL34 roar" amp around it's price range. It's got "The Marshall Sound". Even to me the JSX didn't "sound like a Marshall." You could use it for the same music and it'd sound great but it still sounds different.

It's kinda a working man's amp, the DSL. That's how I look at it. Like the HRDx... it does a few things well but it certainly gives you a sound you can use at a price you can manage, and it's great but there's better stuff out there.

[misterwhizzy]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

I can see that. the DSL, although designated to be the heir to the "JCM" line, it kinda isn't marshall "flagship" quality. The amp has quirks and flaws, and could use things like a choke, etc. I mean, it IS PCB.

I never really understood this. I understand that hand-wired amps are often very robust, and they're easy to fix if something comes undone. But PCB does not make an amp bad. I know all the Fryette stuff is PCB, and I'm pretty sure almost everything is these days. It costs a lot less to run a machine than it does to pay a human.

I know there are badly-built handwired amps, and I know there are great PCB amps. I don't think one is necessarily better than the other.

[Benjy_26]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

My Rivera's a modern, multi-channel, PCB amp. PCB does not equal "bad" by default.

[oilpit]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

DSLs are VERY ok and TSLs just suck...

Marshall needs to stop all this multi-knob, multi-channel BS and just start making JCM800's again. When people complain about no clean channel/no death metal channel they should just buy a Mesa, boom, problem solved.

Seriously, all this new stuff sounds so average it's sad.

[TattooedCarrot]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

Had a DSL50's, great amps that cover a lot of tonal ground. Moved on to other flavors but I could see myself getting another one down the road.

[FuseG4]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

I never really understood this. I understand that hand-wired amps are often very robust, and they're easy to fix if something comes undone. But PCB does not make an amp bad. I know all the Fryette stuff is PCB, and I'm pretty sure almost everything is these days. It costs a lot less to run a machine than it does to pay a human.

I know there are badly-built handwired amps, and I know there are great PCB amps. I don't think one is necessarily better than the other.

the people who are willing to handwire an amp usually spend more time on all the other components being put together well.

It's about the total effort invested in the amp.

Why would you make a PCB amp? ease of manufacturing and production cost, right? A PCB amp is more likely to contain less-than-the-best workmanship and materials because that's HOW you produce an amp quickly and cheaply.

PCB is not a CAUSE it's a SYMPTOM.
there are always exceptions

[FuseG4]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

My Rivera's a modern, multi-channel, PCB amp. PCB does not equal "bad" by default.

generally riveras cost more than PCB marshalls...

Marshall's probably using PCB to churn out amps. They "handwire" the ones that they feel SHOULD be a better product than the DSL.

Rivera obviously can engineer a great product solely on PCB, but you get charged for it! The probably use PCB to keep things consistent and maybe to cut costs a lil.

I love fender's twin reverb RI, but it's PCB. But people go on all the time about the originals being better. They almost certainly are, of only for reliability reasons and ease or repair! Fender's gotta worry about quick/simple warranty replacements, cost of production, all that, so Fender's gonna use PCB and that be extension means they'll probably skimp on a few things here and there vs. how the original blackface ones were.

Does that make it a BAD amp? No, but it may not be as good as an original or a boutique clone.

Just comparing the DSL to higher end "handwired" marshalls... which do you hear about being in the shop more often? The DSL line has problems with crappy speaker jack wiring, sometimes reverb problems, channel switching mishaps, that kinda stuff. Specifically Marshall's PCB stuff generally doesn't seem as reliable as the handwired stuff which they must take more time and effort on.

[FuseG4]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

Anyways, lets talk tubes. What have you used in your JCM 2000, what do you like, how do you bias?
What tubes have you hated?
Anyone here go the NOS route?

my v1 is a japanese tube. Sounds great! pretty clear, a lil less fizz in the gain than most new stuff.
v2 and v3= EH
v4 JJ short plate
Shuguang EL34B's at 39 ma per side.

[TattooedCarrot]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

I like JJ power and Tung-Sol Reissue 12AX7's in most my amps.

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

Anyways, lets talk tubes. What have you used in your JCM 2000, what do you like, how do you bias?
What tubes have you hated?
Anyone here go the NOS route?

my v1 is a japanese tube. Sounds great! pretty clear, a lil less fizz in the gain than most new stuff.
v2 and v3= EH
v4 JJ short plate
Shuguang EL34B's at 39 ma per side.

See my post here:

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/showthread.php?t=198024

Try a long plate tube in the PI. BTW, you don't need Texas Heats or GBs. You need G12H30s.

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

Also I wonder what a 12AT7 would do in the PI in that amp? I don't know, but it would be an easy and reversable, but interesting experiment, that wouldn't hurt anything. It might improve the clean Ch without degrading the gain tones? Also wonder about a 5751 in V1 and how it would effect the red ch. Once again reversable if you hate it.

[lowenzz]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

It's about the total effort invested in the amp.

A PCB amp is more likely to contain less-than-the-best workmanship and materials because that's HOW you produce an amp quickly and cheaply.

PCB is not a CAUSE it's a SYMPTOM.
there are always exceptions

Couldn't be more wrong IMHO sir. Look at the friggin SLO100 from Soldano. Soldano's use Mil Spec grade components and nothing less. One of the most badass amps ever. And my personal dream amp. Look at all of those glorious old JCM800's.
VHT's, Rivera's, Mesa's. Guess what PCB Bud.


Component quality has absolutely nothing to do with PCB or no PCB. There are also many different grades of PCB out there. Are the tube sockets PCB mounted or chassis mounted with hand wired leads, the pots, etc...

Component quality is direct byproduct of what market the amp is designed for. Top shelf, vintage NMV, beginner/practice kicker, 17 channels with 84 knobs & switches, etc..

Manufacturers try to be competive in market segment. Want a crap ton of features for little cash, Well I'm gonna guess your not getting a sweet transformer then.

The DSL doesn't have a choke because it's PCB, what, seriously ? It doesn't have a choke because it was not designed for one. If you want one, add it on there and have at it. What possibly led you to believe that if an amp doesn't have a choke or has PCB that it has lower quality components ? Are you feeling the amp is lacking because it doesn't have a choke ?

Hand wired means absolutely nothing to me in the context of positive or negative. PCB's equal consistency and when made right they can be the ultimate in reliablility. Yes PCB's are a plus for mass production obviously. If you want hand wired PTP, there are tons of guys who will build you whatever your heart desires and your wallet can handle.

[FuseG4]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

Couldn't be more wrong IMHO sir. Look at the friggin SLO100 from Soldano. Soldano's use Mil Spec grade components and nothing less. One of the most badass amps ever. And my personal dream amp. Look at all of those glorious old JCM800's.
VHT's, Rivera's, Mesa's. Guess what PCB Bud.


Component quality has absolutely nothing to do with PCB or no PCB. There are also many different grades of PCB out there. Are the tube sockets PCB mounted or chassis mounted with hand wired leads, the pots, etc...

Component quality is direct byproduct of what market the amp is designed for. Top shelf, vintage NMV, beginner/practice kicker, 17 channels with 84 knobs & switches, etc..

Manufacturers try to be competive in market segment. Want a crap ton of features for little cash, Well I'm gonna guess your not getting a sweet transformer then.

The DSL doesn't have a choke because it's PCB, what, seriously ? It doesn't have a choke because it was not designed for one. If you want one, add it on there and have at it. What possibly led you to believe that if an amp doesn't have a choke or has PCB that it has lower quality components ? Are you feeling the amp is lacking because it doesn't have a choke ?

Hand wired means absolutely nothing to me in the context of positive or negative. PCB's equal consistency and when made right they can be the ultimate in reliablility. Yes PCB's are a plus for mass production obviously. If you want hand wired PTP, there are tons of guys who will build you whatever your heart desires and your wallet can handle.

In the end I'm saying they used cheap PCB because they wanted a "cheaper amp".

It doesn't have a choke because they wanted a cheaper amp. It also has PCB because they wanted a cheaper amp.
I just wanted to sum it up by saying it's a PCB amp when the upper level Marshall stuff isn't PCB, it's handwired. I was just trying to say it's one of marshall's cheaper designs.

[Lucid_Lunatic]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

[FuseG4]

Re: Marshall JCM2000 owners, reunite!

i always love seeing that pic