Passive bass pickups with active EQ--underrated setup?

[El Dunco]

El Dunco, spot on as usual. I think Alex defeats the standard thinking that picked bass for metal is better and more consistent. Alex sounds like he's using a pick when he's using his fingers.

I think finger bassists are also more rounded players and can do more styles and techniques.

What Rex is doing is exactly what I need to work on. Just getting out the click and upping it every day.

Not my ideal tone by any means but I realize it's in a mix. SN2 is also kind of a throwaway song IMO, as is a lot of stuff on the second side of that album (I bought it first as a cassette). I much preferred Hell's Wrath and I Can't Hide from 101 Proof.

Hell’s Wrath is one of my favourites. That whole album has such a real palpable anger, bitterness and misery all through that makes it devastatingly effective. From the first few seconds, you know the fun’s over and they’re really not messing around. Hits me where I live.

[Inflames626]

Also except for the low/flubby notes under the SN2 mix, I'd say that's the opposite tone Rex would get out of his Thunderbird these days.

Not sure it matters. That's just not the tone I associate with a Gibson bass.

[El Dunco]

Also except for the low/flubby notes under the SN2 mix, I'd say that's the opposite tone Rex would get out of his Thunderbird these days.

Not sure it matters. That's just not the tone I associate with a Gibson bass.

That would be the 5th string of the Spector when the notes sound a bit less punchy. Hell’s Wrath and War Nerve isolated are a bit brighter sounding, 10’s is a bit more worn in.

[Inflames626]

This reminds me of a thread I had with Facebook plebs about James MacDonough (short lived bassist in Megadeth after Ellefson, from about 2004-6, later went to Iced Earth).

His complaint was he was a finger player and Mustaine insisted MacDonough use a pick. He never liked how it felt so eventually he asked to leave. He was grateful to Dave for giving him a shot but ultimately said it wasn't a good fit.

All the plebs were saying you have to use a pick to be a good metal bassist. I said you could dial in to compensate and Mustaine should have been more flexible since finger players are usually better bassists overall and pick players are usually just guitarists playing bass.

[Inflames626]

That would be the 5th string.

I believe they only went to Db in those days, with the usual slightly flat Pantera-ness to it.

[El Dunco]

I believe they only went to Db in those days, with the usual slightly flat Pantera-ness to it.

Yes, but if you listen closely, he’s using a 5 string with that 5th string tuned down to A (in their 432hz quarter tuning). Check out the 13 Steps To Nowhere track, he pulls off some super low notes in the breakdown. Drag The Waters is Db/C#

[Inflames626]

Yes, but if you listen closely, he’s using a 5 string with that 5th string tuned down to A. Check out the 13 Steps To Nowhere track, he pulls off some super low notes in the breakdown.

I always wondered why a lot of the 80s/90s guys (mainly Newsted) used a 5 string live when few if any of their songs were in a tuning that required it.

I guessed it was to play a 4th/5th below for added muscle, but this usually produces some added tension that I usually didn't hear between bass and guitar live. By tension I mean if you try to play A minor pentatonic licks over E5 at 12th fret.

[Rex_Rocker]

I've never really understood aggressive picking unless a part calls for it.

Well, my reasoning is it's Metal. It's supposed to be aggressive all throughout.

Finger playing on bass is harder to master, I think. It's like classical playing. You have to get the dynamics even, but once you are there and can do it consistently it takes less energy than playing fast with a pick.

I don't think it's about more efficiency. At least not for me. But I don't have a Petrucci approach to bass with the efficiency and whatnot. Or with any instrument, for that matter. I just like the sound of guitars or bass being picked hard and agressive. At least the heavy parts, which like what, 99.9% of what I play.

I started out playing bass finger-style because that's what my teacher at that time said bass supposed to be played like. Until I realized that was the biggest part of what I wasn't getting the tone I wanted.

I later realized the other half was because all of the tones I was looking up to had a hint of distortion in there. Not many beginner bass amps have built-in distortion. My Ampeg BA certainly does not. So as soon as I got my MXR M80, I realized I didn't have to crank the treble to get the klank I was looking for. The distortion just brings it out in a much more musical and controllable way. A compressor pedal also helps. I used to use the EHX Black Finger which is tube, so it also overdrove a little.

For me, using a compressor with bass is kinda like using a Tube Screamer with a high-gain amp for guitar. Like, it almost automatically make anything sound better 90% of the time.

[Rex_Rocker]

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/5dj7i5xndo4ukoh0q2w9p/VEM-Song-3.mp3?rlkey=9w6yk2sm37x0u73n7ythwsob0&dl=0

I guess this is my track (Pantera-inspired) where the bass cuts through the most.

[Inflames626]

The harder I play bass the more inconsistent the dynamics become because the upstrokes have to be a lot harder to produce consistent tone. It sounds like Rex has almost a flutter effect going and I prefer that because it's consistent.

I tend to dig into guitar pretty hard for Paul Gilbert esque precision, but bass I don't really mind some blurring. I usually have to compress it quite a bit anyway to get it even.

Not a fan of the clank unless it's a hardcore/nu metal tune. There will be some grit needed on the pick attack to cut through but generally I see metal guys using way more grit than I would use. I like the grit left to the guitars, the click left to the kick, and the warmth left to the bass.

Euge Valovirta has some really good production videos. One is on bass here. I commented in the comment section.

I like a passive PJ sound these days more than an active dual soapbar click.

Still, even Euge has a little more Lemmy in that tone than what I would use and that's a pretty tame tone for clank bass.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfs1gpBwVM4&lc=Ugx6f_8wz7VCkruhOzh4AaABAg.9wZ2biLYZ209wZhXrhyNpZ

[Inflames626]

I've never tried a drum transient shaper on bass but I may to see how it goes. I prefer sharpening the pick attacks to adding grit.

[Rex_Rocker]

The harder I play bass the more inconsistent the dynamics become because the upstrokes have to be a lot harder to produce consistent tone. It sounds like Rex has almost a flutter effect going and I prefer that because it's consistent.

I tend to dig into guitar pretty hard for Paul Gilbert esque precision, but bass I don't really mind some blurring. I usually have to compress it quite a bit anyway to get it even.

Not a fan of the clank unless it's a hardcore/nu metal tune. There will be some grit needed on the pick attack to cut through but generally I see metal guys using way more grit than I would use. I like the grit left to the guitars, the click left to the kick, and the warmth left to the bass.

Euge Valovirta has some really good production videos. One is on bass here. I commented in the comment section.

I like a passive PJ sound these days more than an active dual soapbar click.

Still, even Euge has a little more Lemmy in that tone than what I would use and that's a pretty tame tone for clank bass.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfs1gpBwVM4&lc=Ugx6f_8wz7VCkruhOzh4AaABAg. 9wZ2biLYZ209wZhXrhyNpZ

That's not klank-city, and it's a bit darker than I prefer, but it does have a lot of grit going on. Thought you didn't like distortion on bass? I don't really dislike that tone, TBH.

Kohle also had a nice video regarding bass tones where he got some interesting tones. "Better" than Euge's, IMO. As much as Euge's a nice player, I think Kohle's mixes are way better.

Looks like he's going for a massive scoop as well. For me, that tone sounds MUCH more polished and well-produced.

[Inflames626]

I realize some clank will probably be needed to cut through a mix, but I'd rather emphasize it on EQ than actually add distortion.

I like most plugins based on Sansamp stuff. Here's a good example. I like the tones better earlier in the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvDTLWVr4J8

[Inflames626]

Some of their pedals:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0OrqyQLdlM

Their PSA rackmount from the early 90s:

https://youtu.be/ts5-VB65Dmw?t=551

[Inflames626]

Leon Todd covers a lot of rackmounted units from the 80s and 90s that were used when I was in high school. Really nice channel for what would now be considered vintage gear.