Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

What can I say but "I don't blame any American company for moving their operations out of the US." We're no longer business friendly, and we don't manufacture anything anymore. Unless, you're Seymour, and you're trying to abide....and then you've got them cracking down on you for using lead based solder.

Remember Ross Perot's giant sucking sound? It's the sound of jobs leaving the country.
 
Last edited:
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

iismet said:
It's a Republic
Click to expand...

Yes, it's also a republic. Technically, the US is a representative democracy in the form of a constitutional republic. But this still doesn't change my point. People control the government, not the other way around.


iismet said:
See => 9/11, Patriot Act, TSA, Iraq War, Libyan War, Syrian War, blah, blah, blah
Click to expand...

See => Pearl Harbour, Japanese American Internment, McCarthyism, Vietnam War, Korean War, Jim Crow Laws, blah blah blah.

What's new or different going on that hasn't happened before in US history?


iismet said:
See => Bilderberg Group, Hacking Democracy
Click to expand...

See => Conspiracy Theories

Electoral fraud is always a risk with any voting system. If you think that fraud is so widespread that it is putting the US president into power though . . . I'd need to refer you to the above link.


iismet said:
See => General Motors, Chrysler, GE

Also See => Goldman Sachs, AIG, CITI, JP Morgan Chase, Bank of America
Click to expand...

Can't argue with you on this one. . .
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

GuitarStv said:
See => Pearl Harbour, Japanese American Internment, McCarthyism, Vietnam War, Korean War, Jim Crow Laws, blah blah blah.

What's new or different going on that hasn't happened before in US history?

Electoral fraud is always a risk with any voting system.


People control the government, not the other way around.
Click to expand...

:dot:
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

How can you guys get so worked up when you don't know any facts about the case.

It's going to proceed whether you'd like it to or not, so you might as well wait for the facts. All of the this is destroying America statements are currently unfounded.
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

Are we ever going to see a written statement?

Is he thinking his personality and way of speaking will convince people?
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

If the feds are going after Gibson, it's only a matter of time before they decide to go after other companies like Fender, ESP, PRS, Ibanez, etc. This is because IMO, the overseas manufacturers who are in chaoots with the US based CEOS, who hire substandard overseas labor, are probably *****ing that companies such as Gibson, are cutting into their profits .
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

Kramer Guy said:
If the feds are going after Gibson, it's only a matter of time before they decide to go after other companies like Fender, ESP, PRS, Ibanez, etc. This is because IMO, the overseas manufacturers who are in chaoots with the US based CEOS, who hire substandard overseas labor, are probably *****ing that companies such as Gibson, are cutting into their profits .
Click to expand...

The search warrant clearly says that they accuse Gibson of knowing.
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

uOpt said:
Are we ever going to see a written statement?

Is he thinking his personality and way of speaking will convince people?
Click to expand...

I present a side of the argument. I am not a cheer leader. If you don't like or believe the info I present, there is nothing I can do about it. There are those out there that do know of what I present, and there will be those that will look. My opinion matters not.

Franknfilms said:
I can't believe I actually visited this website. Couldn't get past the first minute. GB: "I think I have a gibson at home"

YOU THINK???? YOU DON"T KNOW? What a piece of ****.
Click to expand...

yes- I wanted to puke also at that statement, but i would expect nothing more from Beck - happens all the time from almost all media outlets.

Trust me - Glenn Beck is no friend to me or this country and that is being beyond polite. I listen to a few Right and Left talking heads (Beck aint one of them) and it is very painful. I picked this link up from another Guitar Forum.

I have not seen a MSM interview with Gibsons CEO yet and I doubt I will. Perhaps FOX Business (Napolitano) will or has, but I have not seen it. If someone has seen one, please share.

Beck is of no consequence, his damage is done. Listen to the dialogue. Maybe Juszkiewicz is being untruthful, but it is in his own words. If he is being truthful, my jaw is on the floor, but only reinforces my conviction on the State of The Union.

Also I am no Gibson fan - once they cut out the little shops, I was done. I am anti GOVCO under it's current configuration (last 30 years) and that crosses both parties equally.

We are fast reaching a cross roads. There's lot's of young guy's on this forum, if I can get one to look outside the box, I have contributed.

Gold is bumping $1900 - That is not without consequence.

"What else on earth would you have me do?" :)
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

iismet said:
I have not seen a MSM interview with Gibsons CEO yet and I doubt I will. Perhaps FOX Business (Napolitano) will or has, but I have not seen it. If someone has seen one, please share.
Click to expand...

Tadah! Link to FOX News article


Court documents help explain the root of the tree dispute. According to search warrants associated with the latest raid, federal agents in June intercepted a shipment of Indian ebony apparently bound for Gibson in Tennessee. The documents noted that Indian law "prohibits the export of sawn wood," which can be used for fingerboards -- but does not prohibit the export of "veneers," which are sheets of woods that have already been worked on.

The search warrants alleged that the intercepted shipment was "falsely declared" as veneer, something that would have been legal. However, the documents said the ebony was in fact unfinished "sawn wood," supposedly illegal.

This led to the raid on Gibson facilities late last month.

Juszkiewicz said in a statement that the U.S. government has effectively suggested "that the use of wood from India that is not finished by Indian workers is illegal, not because of U.S. law, but because it is the Justice Department's interpretation of a law in India."

 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

iismet said:
I present a side of the argument. I am not a cheer leader. If you don't like or believe the info I present, there is nothing I can do about it. There are those out there that do know of what I present, and there will be those that will look. My opinion matters not.



yes- I wanted to puke also at that statement, but i would expect nothing more from Beck - happens all the time from almost all media outlets.

Trust me - Glenn Beck is no friend to me or this country and that is being beyond polite. I listen to a few Right and Left talking heads (Beck aint one of them) and it is very painful. I picked this link up from another Guitar Forum.

I have not seen a MSM interview with Gibsons CEO yet and I doubt I will. Perhaps FOX Business (Napolitano) will or has, but I have not seen it. If someone has seen one, please share.

Beck is of no consequence, his damage is done. Listen to the dialogue. Maybe Juszkiewicz is being untruthful, but it is in his own words. If he is being truthful, my jaw is on the floor, but only reinforces my conviction on the State of The Union.

Also I am no Gibson fan - once they cut out the little shops, I was done. I am anti GOVCO under it's current configuration (last 30 years) and that crosses both parties equally.

We are fast reaching a cross roads. There's lot's of young guy's on this forum, if I can get one to look outside the box, I have contributed.

Gold is bumping $1900 - That is not without consequence.

"What else on earth would you have me do?" :)
Click to expand...




Agreed, if this interview is factual this is really disturbing stuff. The business climate in this country right now is horrific to say the least. I will divulge somthing to you guys I heard a couple of weeks ago and it was very underhanded but never the less......ok I did it. I sat at a expensive restaurant for lunch (cant afford it for dinner). In walks two execs from a huge company I had seen speak so I knew who they were. I am mostly done but they are just ordering now and after ordering they are talking in the time it takes to get there food. I wondered what those two would talk about at lunch and one was seated right behind me so.......I listened in hopeing it might be stock or somthing. Instead they were discussing how much big corperate money was sitting on the sidelines outside the country becouse big business was not willing to be taxed to death and lose there ability to compete in the global economy just to fund a bunch of proposed government sponsered socialist type entitlement programs and if thats the way the country is heading they thought most companies would move elsware along with there cash. Big business cannot afford to be over taxed or over regulated constantly and remain competetive. I have heard interviewers ask current government leaders "how will we pay for these big entitlement type programs your suggesting?" and the response is allways "were going to tax the rich and big business". These are the job creators people, if we go after more of there money they simpley move elsware. Higher taxes for the business's left, means less money to hire new people. This whole thing has gotten way out of hand and its makeing the recession last longer then it needed to.
 
Last edited:
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

fretburner said:
Tadah! Link to FOX News article


Court documents help explain the root of the tree dispute. According to search warrants associated with the latest raid, federal agents in June intercepted a shipment of Indian ebony apparently bound for Gibson in Tennessee. The documents noted that Indian law "prohibits the export of sawn wood," which can be used for fingerboards -- but does not prohibit the export of "veneers," which are sheets of woods that have already been worked on.

The search warrants alleged that the intercepted shipment was "falsely declared" as veneer, something that would have been legal. However, the documents said the ebony was in fact unfinished "sawn wood," supposedly illegal.

This led to the raid on Gibson facilities late last month.

Juszkiewicz said in a statement that the U.S. government has effectively suggested "that the use of wood from India that is not finished by Indian workers is illegal, not because of U.S. law, but because it is the Justice Department's interpretation of a law in India."

Click to expand...

They read the same thing that was posted here, there is no new information here.

The problem is that the story is probably a bit deeper.
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

I watched the youtube vid of Henry talking about this. It's perplexing, cuz like many of you have pointed out, it's impossible to know if Henry is saying the truth or really knows at all, but if true, things he said in that interview were disturbing. He did mention criminal liablilty not just of the company, but of RETAILERS who buy their guitars and resell them. This is at about 13:00.
I misunderstood this at first myself, and thought he was saying that liability extended to end users. He doesn't mention that.


I believe Indian rosewood is used by other manufacturers. Not as commonly as mahogany.

In the video, Henry swears up and down that the wood that Gibson uses is completely legal and they are innocent of criminal activity.

I have to wonder if there was a disgruntled employee or a p1ssed off customer, or perhaps an unscrupulous competitor involved. Hard to prove though. But if it turns out that Gibson is indeed innocent, but someone called to tip the feds off, it will look pretty suspicious.
 
Last edited:
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

fretburner said:
Court documents help explain the root of the tree dispute. According to search warrants associated with the latest raid, federal agents in June intercepted a shipment of Indian ebony apparently bound for Gibson in Tennessee. The documents noted that Indian law "prohibits the export of sawn wood," which can be used for fingerboards -- but does not prohibit the export of "veneers," which are sheets of woods that have already been worked on.

The search warrants alleged that the intercepted shipment was "falsely declared" as veneer, something that would have been legal. However, the documents said the ebony was in fact unfinished "sawn wood," supposedly illegal.

This led to the raid on Gibson facilities late last month.

Juszkiewicz said in a statement that the U.S. government has effectively suggested "that the use of wood from India that is not finished by Indian workers is illegal, not because of U.S. law, but because it is the Justice Department's interpretation of a law in India."

Click to expand...
If this is so, it effectively bars American manufacturing of guitars using Indian rosewood while allowing the importation of foreign made guitars or finished parts using the wood.
This is really screwed up: a law effectively working against US manufacturing and craftsmanship.
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

Kosh Naranek said:
If this is so, it effectively bars American manufacturing of guitars using Indian rosewood while allowing the importation of foreign made guitars or finished parts using the wood.
This is really screwed up: a law effectively working against US manufacturing and craftsmanship.
Click to expand...

And that's the funniest thing about this whole pickle.

Suppose, Gibson has workers in India make complete fretboards,they'd comply to Indian law. What us law would they be violating?
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

iismet said:
We are fast reaching a cross roads. There's lot's of young guy's on this forum, if I can get one to look outside the box, I have contributed.
Click to expand...

I'm 31. Am I young? Does that still count? If so, how can I be as smart as you?

I'd take the grammar correction tack, but that's too childish even for me.
 
Re: Buy a Gibson, become a criminal: only in America...

Gearjoneser said:
What can I say but "I don't blame any American company for moving their operations out of the US." We're no longer business friendly, and we don't manufacture anything anymore. Unless, you're Seymour, and you're trying to abide....and then you've got them cracking down on you for using lead based solder.

Remember Ross Perot's giant sucking sound? It's the sound of jobs leaving the country.
Click to expand...

firebirdV said:
How can you guys get so worked up when you don't know any facts about the case.

It's going to proceed whether you'd like it to or not, so you might as well wait for the facts. All of the this is destroying America statements are currently unfounded.
Click to expand...

Kramer Guy said:
If the feds are going after Gibson, it's only a matter of time before they decide to go after other companies like Fender, ESP, PRS, Ibanez, etc. This is because IMO, the overseas manufacturers who are in chaoots with the US based CEOS, who hire substandard overseas labor, are probably *****ing that companies such as Gibson, are cutting into their profits .
Click to expand...

Powdered Toast Man said:
The only thing criminal about Gibson is their prices.
Click to expand...

First off doesn't anyone else besides me find it funny, that our economy and nation is in the tank, yet we find time and money to waste on this, when we could be more productive somewhere else.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

I
Just Trying for Decent Wood
Replies
8
Views
1K
Hellion
Hellion
kherman
More Gibson news!
2 3
Replies
58
Views
8K
Zerberus
Zerberus
Back
Top